Is it the double bend or is it the paddler? It is good to see the re-birth of the double bend, but we all started doing double bends when the Tahitians were schooling everyone in the Channel. When Lanikai were winning the Channel, we all wanted what they wanted, Kialoa straight shaft. ( outrigger, Makana Alii )
Has the double bend changed placements in overall finish at races for those who have gone to them? Has those who still use straight shaft place better than in past without the double bend? So, is it the blade or is it the training that makes the paddler/crew?
What do the Tahitians think of the double bends here compared to theirs?
Just had a conversation with Scott who makes Broadreach at the HVA race...
If I understood him right, he and I both agree that the only major difference is that the double bend takes some pressure off of your lower wrist while getting positive angle on the reach. To get the same angle with the top hand in the same place your wrist can remain less tweaked.
Talking to Manutea Owens of Tahiti he articulated it as a more comfortable position of both his top and bottom hands while paddle-steering a V1 (more options for comfortable angles of blade).
In the end, it?s really not a big deal. mostly comfort.
-Kapono
I agree. More comfortable. I am down to 2 paddles. A broadreach with he big tahitian blade and my tahiti rame. they are both super comfy but I can pull more water with the broadreach so it just depends on what im doing each day as to which paddle I use. If I get anything else ill replace them each with the same thing.
i've paddled a double bend that i made myself with a comically huge blade. it kicks my butt every time i use it.
just the other day i paddled with a Makana Ali'i. it was so amazingly awesome compared to mine. light as all get up and really good grab.
i have a Kalaoa on order from the big island. saw puni at the race around the hat and it looks like a sweet blade. can't wait to try her.
in the 80's i used a double bend by Dan Kahler from Lokahi Canoe Club. at the time it was a sweet paddle. now i pick it up and she feels super heavy in the blade. so if there is one thing that has gotten better since then it is the light materials and overall balance of the paddles.
other than that i just told Puni i wanted one like his. it looked like it was about similar in size to a Broad Reach or Makana Ali'i. fairly thin shaft with carbon wrap around the area where you grip with your lower hand. felt light and balanced. think you can see Puni's paddle in the photo thread for the race around the hat. paddle on left in image below. two people won paddles like this in the post race drawing too.
Looking at the picture above, it would seem that a double bend paddle might fit better with the Tahitian style stroke (faster/shorter). Assuming a paddler maintains the same rotation of his body with each paddle, it looks as if the blade position of a double bend would start closer to the paddler as it enters the water vs. a single bend - thus requiring a slightly earlier exit so as not to pull the blade to far back. May be this is related to anykine's comment above?
....or maybe this is just way to early in the morning and not enough coffee for a post like this.
Thanks for the info. Anykine I know what you mean, same thing with the boat or the paddler right. My question use would be more for the V1 usage. I love my mudbrook for the OC's.
I love the double bend!!! But you should try it and make sure you feel comfortable with it before you buy one.
It depends on your kind of stroke too..... I know people that likes it on surfing conditions but doesn't like it on the flat water. For me it works pretty good surf or flat, my wrists are happy with it, I use for OC1, V1 and OC6 (it sucks when everybody else has straight shaft, it's hard to timing).
But if you like the straight shaft for your OC1, it's same thing for V1.
It's a personal preference, not a canoe accessory.
P.S.: There is Tahitians using straight shaft (Kialoa with carbon fiber blade, just like the ones used here) in Tahiti for V1s and V6s.
I've been mostly using my straight shaft Kia Kaha for the last year, but I sometimes go back into my double bend Gillespie. From what I've been feeling (your mileage may vary) I think there is a stroke style difference with regard to paddle speed/rate. The DB seems to allow me to "punch up the pace" and maintain a faster rate more comfortably, and I tend to have a slight bend and punch motion on my top hand. When I use the SS, I appear to maintain a more rigid/wide triangle and do a much more pronounced lean and plunge up front. I prefer not to use my DB if I'm in a wa'a with every one else using SS, and vice versa. Blending being the main ting.
punis paddle is the one he made himself.. look at kekoas double bend in the pic next to puni thats the on i make.. so far only good feedback ..on it and puni just joined the manabaldes team and im making his custom double bend blades right now ..
I would agree with island life about odis double bends paddle there super light and have a slight flex to the paddle whim you inter the water & pull I love that paddle
Keauhou novices beat the crap out of odis paddles this year in regatta season and don't think a single one broke. Solid paddles, super smooth and its always mice when the easy choice is a small kine guy, not a big corporate deal.
Mahalo everyone for the positive feed back! Its paddlers like yourselves who speak your mind and help progress the sport!
I agree with jpi92109, support your local paddle maker! Weather its Broad Reach, Makana Alii, Mana Blades, or any of the other local guys out there putting their heart and soul into what they do!
Oh, and big Mahalo to Jeremy at HVA and all the sponsors of the Race Around the Hat! Keep up the good work!
I agree with danny sanchez I have his new double bend and its comfortable from the tee to the shaft to the entry i got a 9 1/2 size blade and it fells like it grabs alot of water. Very good in the v1 didnt try it in any othter canoe, but iam sure it would work fine...
http://www.kialoa.com/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=43
http://www.maoliwaa.com/Maoli_Waa/Paddles%3A_Tahiti_Rames.html
#1 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 10:57am
There are a few guys on the Kona side making some nice paddles. Some of them have been sold here on OCpaddler.
#2 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 11:25am
I like my Gillespie Special Ultralight double bee.
http://gillespiepaddles.com/
#3 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 12:58pm
Is it the double bend or is it the paddler? It is good to see the re-birth of the double bend, but we all started doing double bends when the Tahitians were schooling everyone in the Channel. When Lanikai were winning the Channel, we all wanted what they wanted, Kialoa straight shaft. ( outrigger, Makana Alii )
Has the double bend changed placements in overall finish at races for those who have gone to them? Has those who still use straight shaft place better than in past without the double bend? So, is it the blade or is it the training that makes the paddler/crew?
What do the Tahitians think of the double bends here compared to theirs?
#4 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 2:51pm
Just had a conversation with Scott who makes Broadreach at the HVA race...
If I understood him right, he and I both agree that the only major difference is that the double bend takes some pressure off of your lower wrist while getting positive angle on the reach. To get the same angle with the top hand in the same place your wrist can remain less tweaked.
Talking to Manutea Owens of Tahiti he articulated it as a more comfortable position of both his top and bottom hands while paddle-steering a V1 (more options for comfortable angles of blade).
In the end, it?s really not a big deal. mostly comfort.
-Kapono
www.maoliwaa.com
#5 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 4:54pm
I agree. More comfortable. I am down to 2 paddles. A broadreach with he big tahitian blade and my tahiti rame. they are both super comfy but I can pull more water with the broadreach so it just depends on what im doing each day as to which paddle I use. If I get anything else ill replace them each with the same thing.
#6 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 6:13pm
i've paddled a double bend that i made myself with a comically huge blade. it kicks my butt every time i use it.
just the other day i paddled with a Makana Ali'i. it was so amazingly awesome compared to mine. light as all get up and really good grab.
i have a Kalaoa on order from the big island. saw puni at the race around the hat and it looks like a sweet blade. can't wait to try her.
in the 80's i used a double bend by Dan Kahler from Lokahi Canoe Club. at the time it was a sweet paddle. now i pick it up and she feels super heavy in the blade. so if there is one thing that has gotten better since then it is the light materials and overall balance of the paddles.
#7 Fri, 09/25/2009 - 6:53pm
Hi Jc9 0,
Waht are the specs on your new blade ? Just wondering.
aloha,
pog
#8 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 12:09am
sheesh, not even sure!
51" long?
other than that i just told Puni i wanted one like his. it looked like it was about similar in size to a Broad Reach or Makana Ali'i. fairly thin shaft with carbon wrap around the area where you grip with your lower hand. felt light and balanced. think you can see Puni's paddle in the photo thread for the race around the hat. paddle on left in image below. two people won paddles like this in the post race drawing too.
#9 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 12:31am
Looking at the picture above, it would seem that a double bend paddle might fit better with the Tahitian style stroke (faster/shorter). Assuming a paddler maintains the same rotation of his body with each paddle, it looks as if the blade position of a double bend would start closer to the paddler as it enters the water vs. a single bend - thus requiring a slightly earlier exit so as not to pull the blade to far back. May be this is related to anykine's comment above?
....or maybe this is just way to early in the morning and not enough coffee for a post like this.
#10 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 3:36am
Kalaoa on the big island makes some great double bends. no complaints 4 paddles later and would not look anywhere else! thank you odie.
#11 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 6:26am
Thanks for the info. Anykine I know what you mean, same thing with the boat or the paddler right. My question use would be more for the V1 usage. I love my mudbrook for the OC's.
#12 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 11:42am
I love the double bend!!! But you should try it and make sure you feel comfortable with it before you buy one.
It depends on your kind of stroke too..... I know people that likes it on surfing conditions but doesn't like it on the flat water. For me it works pretty good surf or flat, my wrists are happy with it, I use for OC1, V1 and OC6 (it sucks when everybody else has straight shaft, it's hard to timing).
But if you like the straight shaft for your OC1, it's same thing for V1.
It's a personal preference, not a canoe accessory.
P.S.: There is Tahitians using straight shaft (Kialoa with carbon fiber blade, just like the ones used here) in Tahiti for V1s and V6s.
#13 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 12:34pm
I've been mostly using my straight shaft Kia Kaha for the last year, but I sometimes go back into my double bend Gillespie. From what I've been feeling (your mileage may vary) I think there is a stroke style difference with regard to paddle speed/rate. The DB seems to allow me to "punch up the pace" and maintain a faster rate more comfortably, and I tend to have a slight bend and punch motion on my top hand. When I use the SS, I appear to maintain a more rigid/wide triangle and do a much more pronounced lean and plunge up front. I prefer not to use my DB if I'm in a wa'a with every one else using SS, and vice versa. Blending being the main ting.
#14 Sat, 09/26/2009 - 5:44pm
punis paddle is the one he made himself.. look at kekoas double bend in the pic next to puni thats the on i make.. so far only good feedback ..on it and puni just joined the manabaldes team and im making his custom double bend blades right now ..
#15 Sun, 09/27/2009 - 11:51am
Conan Herbert has some pretty decent paddles, I think it's called the Tai.....
#16 Sun, 09/27/2009 - 11:31pm
I would agree with island life about odis double bends paddle there super light and have a slight flex to the paddle whim you inter the water & pull I love that paddle
#17 Mon, 09/28/2009 - 8:02am
tane vaa, this makes me more excited. thank you.
#18 Mon, 09/28/2009 - 1:24pm
Keauhou novices beat the crap out of odis paddles this year in regatta season and don't think a single one broke. Solid paddles, super smooth and its always mice when the easy choice is a small kine guy, not a big corporate deal.
#19 Mon, 09/28/2009 - 1:27pm
Mahalo everyone for the positive feed back! Its paddlers like yourselves who speak your mind and help progress the sport!
I agree with jpi92109, support your local paddle maker! Weather its Broad Reach, Makana Alii, Mana Blades, or any of the other local guys out there putting their heart and soul into what they do!
Oh, and big Mahalo to Jeremy at HVA and all the sponsors of the Race Around the Hat! Keep up the good work!
Aloha!
-odie
#20 Mon, 09/28/2009 - 9:28pm
aloha odie,
I never got a chance to check out the paddles at the HVA race..anyone got any pics or specs...website shows only SUP paddles...
#21 Tue, 09/29/2009 - 10:55am
Aloha Easy!
We are working on an entire company / logo / web overhaul. Look for a better website and our entire line of outrigger blades here soon.
In the mean time, send me a quick email and I will get you those pics.
Aloha!
-odie
odie@kalaoapaddle.com
#22 Tue, 09/29/2009 - 11:00am
I agree with danny sanchez I have his new double bend and its comfortable from the tee to the shaft to the entry i got a 9 1/2 size blade and it fells like it grabs alot of water. Very good in the v1 didnt try it in any othter canoe, but iam sure it would work fine...
#23 Wed, 09/30/2009 - 4:38am