OC-1 for flatwater

I understand the reluctance to compare canoes on this forum. It's highly subjective and can also vary from paddler to paddler. But perhaps a more focused question could survive discussion. Which canoe might offer more efficient flatter water performance, Huki V1-X or Kamanu Pueo? I won't have an opportunity to paddle either but I trust both manufacturers enough to buy without trying. Sometimes that's just the way it is. My only observation is that the Huki seems to have a flatter waterline length with little or no rocker. I'm making no inferences though. I paddle with my girl and we love our V2-X but the Pueo caught my eye and I have no problem spreading my business around. Thanks for any help.

Submitted by wallace on Thu, 10/21/2010 - 2:35am



I realize that I may be pushing it, but also, which of the two might be considered more "stable"? It might be an issue if my girl paddles it. Thanks


#1 Thu, 10/21/2010 - 8:16am


Wallace
Might consider the Ma'a afi. Although it is a big volume boat,it is very good on the flat water runs. It has a long waterline. May also want to consider the new Pe'a, very stable and manuverable. Kai Chong just got his last week and is already looking good on it. "Big Boys Kick and Glide" "Water Cures All"


#2 Fri, 10/22/2010 - 11:01pm


I'm a female and own a Huki V1-X carbon/kevlar and LOVE IT. So I might be a little bias, but thats my opinion.


#3 Sun, 10/24/2010 - 4:23am


On the flat Hurricane is fast . and my canoe preference. I would jump at a chance to try a Pueo, but I’m in Canada. I tried a Huki V1- X recently and couldn’t believe how fast and light it was , we were on flat water at the time. the yako raddled a bit compared to my canoe. I have got a 8" huki surfing rudder for my canoe and it has a sleeker feel when I turn,


#4 Sun, 10/24/2010 - 6:13am


No brainer in this comparison: Pueo all the way.


#5 Sun, 10/24/2010 - 6:21am


The fastest outrigger on flat water will be a V1 Tahitian lagoon style, not the surfing variety, they are so much faster than an OC1 there is no comparison. BUT, it may not be much fun if you can't get it going in a straight line!!! :0)


#6 Mon, 10/25/2010 - 2:15pm


Jim,

Theres gotta be some V1-X and V1-Zs up there ... If you have not already tried one ... You gotta.
Amazingly fast and smooth.

aloha,
pog

P.S. Edit to add ... The rocker IS different ... Call and let Jude explain it to you. Its his business.


#7 Mon, 10/25/2010 - 9:08pm


Jim's already got extensive experience with the HUKI V1-Z. Probably more than most people who actually own one.


#8 Mon, 10/25/2010 - 9:39pm


Huki is decent, but there's no comparison to Pueo. It's like old toyota truck vs. brand new Ferrari. But get an Aukahi or a 404 SUP unless you paddle in the open ocean a lot.


#9 Tue, 10/26/2010 - 5:41am


Going to jump on this out of curiosity as well since I am almost another person that doesn't really get to demo these boats often.

Why is there no comparison between the Huki and the Pueo? At least in this context we are only referring to flat water. And what about other boats like the Kai'waa boats (Pegasus, Scorpius, Scorpius XM), etc... I hear they are advertised as being good in the surf but does that necessarily mean they are not just as good as boats like the Pueo in the flat?


#10 Tue, 10/26/2010 - 10:31am


I'll answer since I said that: I love the Huki, it's a great all around sea worthy craft, well made and everything, and I've paddled the z quite a bit, but after literally seconds on the pueo the difference was like night and day. To be fair, the pueo was a nice light brand new one, and the Huki is fibreglass, but the feel was just a huge difference, especially in small downwind conditions. The forward footwells and ultra responsive steering of the pueo made it ten times easier to get on a bump for me.


#11 Tue, 10/26/2010 - 1:31pm


And I do think that everyone should consider an SUP, especially in primarily flat water. Yes, I said that jc9. Just my opinion, but it seems like such a good all around workout w/ out all the pressure on the hips. A great way to supplement your training w/ out some of the wear and tear on the body that oc1 seems to cause. I did a 3 hr SUP race and it was cool to not have a sore ass at the end, like Goto gets after a night out at Capitol Hill.


#12 Tue, 10/26/2010 - 1:39pm


If we wanted to stick to OC-1, what about the Scorpius XM? Sucks to be in the Northeast. Don't really get to demo the latest and greatest. I was tempted to get a Pueo earlier but shipping costs push the boat to well over 5k. A China made Scorpius XM is way more affordable so I was wondering how you guys think it would fare in East Coast conditions.


#13 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 3:05am


wallace, are you set on either a huki or pueo? would you consider a rudderless v1? they're really fast in the flats and relatively easy to keep straight (compared to taking off the rudder on a oc1) due to the length and hull shape. the hard part is u-turns. I haven't tried a huki but the hurricane feels just as fast or faster than the pueo in the flats.
good luck!


#14 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 3:46am


Hurricane is faster than Pueo in the flats, proven


#15 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 6:49am


"Hurricane is faster than Pueo in the flats, proven"

jonothans, how was that proven?


#16 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 8:16am


I think I want to stick with a rudder. I paddle a Huki V2-X with my girlfriend and we love it, so I'm tempted to just stay with the brand I know. There's a chance I could get a Pueo shipped next month so I am considering it. The V1-X is light with a long waterline and little rocker so I assumed it would be efficient in milder conditions. I guess there are other factors though.


#17 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 11:21am


Theres many things to concider . price, accesability, I think colour is one. I have a Hurricane and would love to try a pegasus ama on it. what is the fastes ama?


#18 Wed, 10/27/2010 - 1:37pm


no ama


#19 Thu, 10/28/2010 - 12:43am


The new v1x fits and feels felt better to me than the old style seating. Only place it was less fun was side chop where it felt twitchy compared to other boats I have paddled in flatter conditions like a pueo or the bigger zephyr. There is not a lot of reserve under the butt though so if you are tall and like your beer and donuts it may sag a little in the trim which as discussed on OC will effect your glide on any canoe.

The mini rudder option Jude offers is also great for the flats.


#20 Thu, 10/28/2010 - 7:33am


In my experience a hurricane glides better in the flat water like that we find in the NW. Last week I did a race on a Pueo, love the boat, excelerates fast, especially on any bump, but the hurricane has a faster glide factor. My opinion.


#21 Thu, 10/28/2010 - 7:34am


no opinions on the scorpius xm?


#22 Fri, 10/29/2010 - 4:52am


Nothing wrong with the XM on the flat either, sitting low in the canoe you just have to make the adjustment over time to get the power down, over 6km course my XM was about 30sec slower than my V1 time (time is immaterial as I was paddling both canoes) and I am not that fast that I want to mention it!!!!!!!!


#23 Fri, 10/29/2010 - 9:51pm


Time to update this posting. :) Does anyone have a comparison of the new Storm on flat water? A 20 lb OC1 sounds pretty interesting...


#24 Wed, 07/24/2013 - 9:16am


MIke Giblin posted on the Ozone web site that he did a test run with another guy of three boats in the flat, the Hurricane, the storm and a new prototype coming out that is a less volume storm (this XS). They tested all three and the Storm came out ahead. I am a Storm owner, so biased, but it gets up to speed quickly and stays up to speed with little work.


#25 Wed, 07/24/2013 - 4:45pm


red_pepper, if you're looking for a flat water storm you may want to try a Hurricane. i thought the Storm was made to surf so it would therefor cost a little flat water speed. perhaps not though for as JMK stated above it is faster in all conditions than anything ozone makes and he can get it up easy and keep it up with little effort.


#26 Wed, 07/24/2013 - 5:03pm


Wallace- did you buy a canoe? Current models to try in the flats are the OZONE XS good for people up to about 165 lbs. (hardly used one sitting on I-5) Hard to find a canoe that is ideal for a small person sharing with a large person (like a pair of running shoes) - size of the canoe and paddle for that matter do really make a difference if one wants to be competitive. Try as many canoes as possible and don't take anyone's word for it as it is what is most comfortable for you and your lady. Size does matter!


#27 Wed, 07/24/2013 - 8:33pm


Rudderless v1 works best in flat waters no drag all feel and will become a better alert paddler!:) aloha


#28 Wed, 07/24/2013 - 8:38pm


Thanks for the feedback. I'm looking for an OC-1 that's has minimal resistance on the flats (I live by flat water, generally race skis and unlimited kayaks, and only rarely get the opportunity to paddle on the big fun stuff) - and I do like a rudder. :) I talked with one owner who thought the Storm was the fastest OC-1 he's tried on down wind runs, but he thought his Huki V1-X was a little faster in the flats and upwind. I have a Huki V2-X that's a blast to paddle, but I do find the split footwells tight on my feet. Noting that the Storm is not only light, but has what appears to be a larger, single footwell, I'm intrigued by this boat. Any thoughts on the comfort of the cockpit? Or other boat recommendations, for that matter? I appreciate your input (not too many outriggers to try out in my area).


#29 Fri, 07/26/2013 - 1:00pm


I should have noted that I'm 6' and about 200 lbs.


#30 Fri, 07/26/2013 - 1:01pm


Here is a response from Mike Gibilin, maker of the Storm and Hurricane on your question...just an FYI I have a storm and I am 6'5'' and 190 and the boat fits great. Single footwell makes sense and is comfortable.

"I have been doing a lot of flat water testing lately with other canoes, and wanted to get out on the Storm in flat water and see if I couldn’t give you a definitive answer. I should have done this a while ago, but I was so focused on the rough water performance of the Storm that I had done nearly all of my paddling downwind. I have been very happy with the rough water performance, but when people in flat water venues ask for my opinion about which canoe is right for them, I have had a hard time wholeheartedly recommending the Storm because I was very focused on surfing.
This morning the wind dropped, and the conditions were good for some flat water testing. I met George Dagan who has been helping me test a new low volume prototype. First we tested the prototype against the Hurricane. After racing point to point, exchanging canoes, and repeating the process several times we concluded that the prototype was slightly faster. Neither of us had managed more than a half a boat length advantage in any of the pieces.
Then we went back to the beach and exchanged the prototype for the Storm, and went out for a couple more trials. As we paddled out I’m thinking, “OK, moment of truth – I hope it’s close”. It wasn’t – he finished two boat lengths ahead. He was on the Storm and I was on the Hurricane. What? We switched canoes, and again the Storm finished decisively in front. After battling for half a boat length over and over in the earlier trials the difference was both clear and surprising.
So I think I’m going to have to change the answer I gave earlier in this thread. On flat days I’m going to take the Storm.
Mike
- See more at: http://outriggerzone.com/support/questions/storm-oc1/#sthash.OE4ad44r.dpuf


#31 Fri, 07/26/2013 - 2:31pm


Great information on the Storm. Thanks!


#32 Sat, 07/27/2013 - 8:17pm


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