Canoe suggestions for 6'7" tall 245 lb novice paddler

I'd appreciate any suggestions on Canoes for 6'7" tall 245 lb male novice paddler .. mostly Kona side of the Big Island but also Hilo waters too. I get lots of info for guys 6'3 or so .. but that extra 4 inches is tough on leg room and balance .. any comments would be appreciated.

Submitted by vytas524 on Tue, 01/30/2007 - 1:12pm



I have heard that a Waveblade or Polaris are good boats for larger paddlers. Haven't paddled either though........


#1 Tue, 01/30/2007 - 7:49pm


never paddled or actually even seen one...but what about the kai wa'a arcturus??


#2 Tue, 01/30/2007 - 8:11pm


Kona J

Considering your size, novice, Kona waters, and issues about stability, I would recommend a used Stingray. I bet you could pick one up for a good price. A Polaris might run you more money


#3 Tue, 01/30/2007 - 8:17pm


recommendations? Train hard.


#4 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 7:32am


Vytas,

I am also 6'7, but a little lighter at 215lbs. I have owned a Makia, Polaris and Fusion. If your budget affords you a new boat, the Fusion is great for larger paddlers, but is less than ideal for smooth water. I like the Makia for flatter conditions, and it was buoyant enough for your size. I would also recommend the Kaimana by John Puakea, which has a great track record in flat water, and is big enough for you. Stingray was previously mentioned, also a fine choice for your size and locale.

Hope that helps, and I empathize with your plight.


#5 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 9:17am


The fuze, fusion, polaris, vantage, stingray, viper, hurricane, makia, waveblade, pahoa, kaimana, naia, naia iki, pegasus, mantra, (did I forget any?) are all good choices.


#6 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 2:09pm


Poop,

You forgot (or did you leave it out on purpose) Surffrigger


#7 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 3:05pm


I am getting sick of POOPOOPADDLER and others slagging every legitimate question novice paddlers have before they drop 3 grand on a canoe....... give it a rest....


#8 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 8:44pm


Let's try keeping it real. Please.

If the paddler is 6 foot 7 inches and 245 pounds- would lower volume canoes like Hurricanes and Naia Iki actually fit or float efficiently?

Try to be a bit more realistic in recommending canoes for novice paddlers.


#9 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 8:48pm


We have a 6' 8'' 250 Lb oc1 paddler in our club and he finds a pegusus ideal and he is top 5 in the results most races. Watching him surf on the pegusus, he does not pearl the nose of the canoe and is able to place the canoe where he wants it on a wave. With his huge strength and leverage he only needs one or two strokes to pull into a trough.

When i paddle next to him i take two strokes to his one. ( I'm 5'9'' and 155Lb) In a flat water time trial (1 hr) he beats me by 2:30. My goal is to find a way of improving the 5% i need to match him. Difficult task as he is a lean 28 year old and me a lean 53 yo.

Sorry to go off topic but a pegusus works for him, ideal volume and good leg room. See attached photo of him on the pegusus

Cheers Rambo


#10 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 10:21pm


I only slag "what's the best one man" questions. I mean come onnnnn. I have seen 200lbs guys kick ass on a hurricane and 140lbs guy kick ass on a viper.

I keeps it real fo shizzle.

Poops


#11 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 10:35pm


slag (slāg) Pronunciation Key
The vitreous mass left as a residue by the smelting of metallic ore. It consists mostly of the siliceous and aluminous impurities from the iron ore.

slag1 /slæg/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[slag] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb, slagged, slag·ging.
–noun
1. Also called cinder. the more or less completely fused and vitrified matter separated during the reduction of a metal from its ore.
2. the scoria from a volcano.
3. waste left over after the re-sorting of coal.
–verb (used with object)
4. to convert into slag.
5. Metallurgy. to remove slag from (a steel bath).
–verb (used without object)
6. to form slag; become a slaglike mass.

slag2 /slæg/
–noun
British Slang. an abusive woman.

slag'gy adj.
slagged, slag·ging, slags
To change into or form slag.

just goes to prove, you say any word enough, and it gets kinda funny. sorry to get off subject, but the slag caught my eye.

that guy is a freakin monster in those pictures. sweet.


#12 Wed, 01/31/2007 - 10:48pm


yeah dude that guy is huge.


#13 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 7:51am


You know what I'M getting sick of? Those stupid bulls&*t pieces of Chinese manufactured plastic garbage that Mr. Kellogg and his ilk continually try to pass off as the "toy suprise inside!" of my Cocoa Puffs. Take me back to the old days when we used to have quality products, like secret decoder rings and baking soda-powered submarines.

But seriously, if you go out and spend three G's (or more!) on something that someone on the World-Wide Waste of time told you is cool, then you're a bigger retard than I thought. Try out what's available in your area, and make your decision based on that. (For the millionth time!) As the photographic and results-based evidence proves, if you're comfortable in it, and you train hard, you can win (or fit) on anything.

...and yes, you lucky bast&*ds, this advice was free. (But I AM accepting donations.)

GOTO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PS - I will try to find a pic - there's a 6'10" guy in my club who can paddle just about anything (and crank!) Pacific NW paddlers, you know who I'm talking about!

PPS - Go, MPI paddling!


#14 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 9:35am


KUDOS GOTO KUDOS. Well said, some people still haven't gotten the message here. Try all the boats and pick what you like, One of the boats in my previous post will suit you well. I wasn't goofing off, its an honest attempt to help. I was keeping it real. Real as it gets fo shizzle.

HOLLA, go MPI paddling. Keeps it real yo! Keeps it real!

Pooopo


#15 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 11:07am


Interesting gaggle of opinions from presumably dimunitive paddlers of questionable pedigree. Lots of chatter obscuring a well-intentioned question from an earnest novice seeking constructive advice. Let me tell you, the average sized paddlers that excel on any canoe don't face the same challenges those 6'7 and up are forced to confront. The boat manufacturers don't account for our unusual length, and the center of gravity is often compromised when configured to fit us. There is not a single 1-man racer in Hawaii over 6'6 and 240 lbs that is in the top-20 ever...
Willpower, fitness levels, etc., can't overcome the design of certain boats intended for smaller paddlers (fuze, hurricane, naia iki, etc.) if you are 6'7 245. Al Lipp and Mike Giblin are the fastest big men on Hurricanes, but they are several inches and 50 lbs. short of our inquiring novice friend from the big island.
As a long time fan of the website, and first time forum contributor, it would be nice to see more constructive and informative input, and less ignorant sass directed towards new paddlers looking for some advice from those who might have some knowledge to contribute.
Soapbox dismount commencing, happy paddling to all!


#16 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 4:18pm


Are you questioning my pedigree?

...bigjed and mangisepik are obviously smart paddlers, who know their OC-1s - all I'm saying is that if you buy a boat just because they said to, WITHOUT TRYING IT FIRST, you're dumb.

I love everyone, G.

...and the reason no one who's 6'6" finishes in the top 20, is because there's no one that tall who lives in Hawaii.


#17 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 5:41pm


Bigjed, although its a downward spiral of ignorance at times, it's QUALITY "sass." It's entertaining and as an American, I demand to be entertained, specifically with sarcastic wit at someone else's expense.


#18 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 5:43pm


Gotta back Bigjed on his post...... Well stated...... Gotta disagree with e02060 ........ There isn't any Quality "sass" happening here......
Back on topic. Someone suggested a Stingray. Good volume but I find the footwells too tight if you have big feet.


#19 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 6:09pm


Hey, you know what I think is funny? (just my opinion...) When people who like to "stay on topic" get all futless 'cause others are being too "sassy" for them.

If anyone reading this thread is feeling a little futless right now, let me know - I got plenty of futs I can share.

fut, GOTO


#20 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 6:34pm


futless, FUTLESS !!!???!!
Are you still in highschool? If you got something to say then say it......


#21 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 7:02pm


and so the insults begin

"presumably dimunitive paddlers of questionable pedigree" do i hear a challenge? did someone just throw the old gauntlet? no one else here felt the need to insult or degrade someone's paddling ability.

"Are you still in highschool?" as a high schooler, i take it personally that you imply high schoolers are of poor character. There are some pretty fast high schoolers now aday. They would probably spank most everyone in a one man. Myself included.

i still say the guy in the picture is huge. perhaps someone tall needs to design a boat for tall people, then sell it. kind of a niche market, but you never know...

Yes e02060, as an american, i too demand to be entertained.


#22 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 7:29pm


Dance you monkeys...


#23 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 7:49pm


oops


#24 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 10:51pm


Any of the deep "Vee" shaped hulls are ususlly suitable for heavy paddlers, the waterline length and displacement is then progressive and you still retain an acceptable centre of buoyancy/centre of balance difference. Rounded hulls are faster, but don't always suit the big guy.

Cheers Rambo


#25 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 8:24pm


wow...that went downhill pretty fast...all those poor people out there who actually want to know about a good boat for tall people have to sort through all this crap...bummer...but on the other hand...all the short people out there are now entertained....oh... and the best boat period...jc-9 sorry to bring up the best boat topic again...but the kaimana wins hands down...now we can get some real controversy going...


#26 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 8:40pm


You know, if you just ignore them.. maybe they'll stop trying to show you how bored there little lives are, and that they have nothing better to do than sit around and think of stupid useless sh*t to say on ANY question that is asked .... I'm sure this will bring all kinds of well thought out remarks from the bored little monkeys. As far as your question vgtas524 if you get a chance, try out the StingRay, Polaris and Vantage as well as getting a great custom seat. A guy with your size and good training, you shouldn't have a problem with any of those listed. Aloha.


#27 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 8:59pm


interesting theory about the increasing volume of a "v" hull. although it would seem that the rounded hull would have the same effect. esp. since the more you sink it, the farther in the round portion of the hull would go. i always asumed that the vee type hull got it's speed from the fact that it could have a longer narrower waterline. that, and i figured a narrow nose would expose less area to friction on the bow, or "push" less water. keizo, the resident engineer, must have some thoughts on this...


#28 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 9:01pm


WOW!

I go off to work and all of a sudden this one is going the way of witness protection! yikes.

I applaud all the large paddlers who have mastered the art of paddling a small canoe. I've been on the loosing end of many time trials to a large paddler on a Huricane, so I know that large guys can paddle small canoes. The only problem with the combo was his weight actually buckled the canoe rear of the seat. An obvious sign that he's just too big for the canoe. In fact we nicknamed the canoe "yellow submarine" because the back half was always underwater.

Specifically for a novice paddler, stable and buoyant is a good thing. Again- try something like a Thunder (you forgot that one too poopoo!) it was designed for guys like Kalani Irvine and Rich Lambert. I don't know if they are over 6'6" or 245# but they wouldn't be considered small guys.


#29 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 9:48pm


That's true JC9_0, for bow and stern wave drag, but the round hull offers less surface area friction over a Vee hull.

Cheers Rambo


#30 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 9:51pm


If you happen to be in Australia this new Oc1 is shaping up to be a "big mans Hurricane" at 2 ft longer, more volume, a super sharp bow and a vee bottom where the Hurricane is flat in the fore hull. Doesn't slap down when going up wind.

Also starting to win alot of races.

http://www.stealthsurfcraft.com/outrigger.html

Cheers Rambo


#31 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 10:24pm


Let me point something out. I've been accused of giving sass, bored with my little life, stupid, being of dimunitive pedigree (that was an interesting one) and wasting everyone's time. But EVERY SINGLE "serious" suggestion of a boat for vytas524 was given in my second post, with the excpetion of the Thunder. So who's wasting time now?

Poops


#32 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 10:26pm


i guess that would be the reason for olympic kayaks having a rounded bottom. never thought of that till you mentioned the round botom being faster, rambo.

on a heavier note, why must things always go personal. seems someone will always take a joke personally. just let it goooo.....serenity now, serenity now.

what? did someone say something?


#33 Thu, 02/01/2007 - 10:42pm


Guess what "bigjed",
There's been plenty of tall paddlers from Hawai'i. Rich Lambert of Lanikai came in 3rd in the Solo on a Naia in 96. Not to mention Bo Eastabrooks, who could beat just about anyone on his Thunder back then. Both of these guys are over 6'7''. Ask your boy Al Lipp, who, by the way, can paddle just about anything pretty well. So Goto is right on with his somewhat smart assed remarks. What's your Pedigree anyway? Are you a horse or something?
Love, Jim.
P.S. Everyone knows all the great paddlers come from Punahou and Kalaheo...only Mid-packers care about ILH paddling anyhoo!


#34 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 5:29am


funny jim should mention that no one cares about ILH paddling. this may be true, but perhaps whoever "they" are should. Since the High School state championship was created, every single girls and boys state champion has been from an ILH school. Including your beloved Puns, Jimothy.


#35 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 8:47am


jc9, I meant no one cares about High School paddling in general, except for mid-packers, since it's the only thing they can dominate. The Lanikai Elementary All-Stars would smoke the best guys in MPI history.


#36 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 8:52am


hey isn't the sniper a larger volume boat?? why didn't we think of that earlier...i mean we just had that whole thread about snipers like last week...


#37 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 9:10am


The Lanikai Elementry Allstar team would, without a doubt, smoke any other elementry allstar team imaginable...good point Jamigus!


#38 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 11:04am


All-Time Lanikai Elementry All-Star Team:
Foti bros., Pete, Kalani, M.S, and Mrs. Lugosa


#39 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 11:15am


are you talking in their prime, and in what venue? some of the best guys from MPI in their prime paddled for the US national and world teams. that said, i was never in that league, i'm just talking about guys who are WAY better than me, so i'll just shut up now.

even goto kicked my ass, but i still blame that on the pink boat i was paddling.

in a molokai race though the lanikai guys would be tough to beat any year.


#40 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 11:42am


Whaddya mean, even Goto? He's pretty much the best guy 'round here. jc9, I think a few PNWRCA races would do wonders for your ego! Which crew would Ernie Crepps be on?


#41 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 11:54am


no one mentioned the Ono either.


#42 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 4:27pm


WAT BODDAH U?!

jc9_0, goto, etc...You guys are some witty mofos!
I am not as old as Rambo (close but not) and I really enjoy your repertoire of jokes and pokes.
Speaking of joke…What’s the difference between a joke and a fart?
A joke is a shift of wit.

One more big canoe to consider; Johnny Puakea probably has the mold for his Elua somewhere.
Ask nice and he may have one available for a test paddle the next time you make it to the North Shore (Oahu).

goto - stash your - cheers - porn - somethin' somethin'


#43 Fri, 02/02/2007 - 4:53pm


6'5, 210 lbs, Nov A

my thoughts: try every boat you can; that is somewhat limited in my experience as you want to have a boat right now, so time is short; but you'll get to paddle two or three different boats easily.

Think about buying a cheaper boat; you may want to upgrade within a year or once you realize what you feel comfortable with.

6'7 and 245 lbs is not close to the general standard for oc1 - probably up to 6'0 and 200 lbs max for the larger boats.

The trim of the boat will be an issue as you will likely sit behind the sweet spot.
The weight may break a boat that is too small - a builder mentioned this, I have not heard of it actually happening.
Leg space is an issue; you will sit with knees pointing up in the air - that will reduce stability. It also puts quite some pressure on your sit bones, your thighs don't rest on anything, long distance that may be a real problem >2:30 hours or so.

One of the major differences in the boats is the width of the beam. Usually they are either 14'' - 'small' boats, or 15'' - larger boats. The resistance has the width in the second power times length of waterline.
14 x 14 = 196 versus 15 x 15 = 225, that is a difference of ~ 12.5 %.

I guess that is the single most important factor. Of course when it comes to surfing ability of the boat other issues matter.

My first year I paddled a larger boat - 15'' beam width, now I am paddling a 14'' beam width 'small' boat. Much less resistance per stroke, I like it quite a bit. No problem except for more challenges with stability.
Thus I think that even a 6'7 person can paddle one of the smaller boats; as per the weight - ther are some smaller paddlers a little overweight, they still do quite well.

Legspace: I am just building a model for an alternative footwell as I want to move forward on my boat. I hope to improve the trim of the boat that way - the rear of my boat is very close to the water surface. I actually like the Naia iki deck/footwell design and hopefully I can mimick that. It's a single footwell. Will that improve the performance of the boat ? Maybe , maybe not, it just seems reasonable to try.

For 6'7 I would ask for a custom made solution; as you all know, some builders have different deck models for different size people. But I would spend 6 months paddling on a boat that is available, brand doesn't matter, and find out how much you like it, which conditions you paddle in most of the time etc, etc - the usual time on the water thing. You will hear enough about all types of boats to make up your mind as time goes by.

Aloha


#44 Sat, 02/03/2007 - 8:50pm


I knew a guy who was 6'8". He sat in his boat in calm water and adjusted the seat using a level to solve the sweet spot problem. This resulted in the high knees thing eckhart just described, but the guy managed to kick ass anyway, especially in races under 2 hrs.


#45 Sun, 02/04/2007 - 1:07am


Trim:

From the internet:
Mark your boat with short, thick, horizontal lines with a marker .5' apart - one below the other, around the expected water line - at the bow, after one quater, in the middle, after three quaters and towards the end.

Then you go into flat water and paddle at race speed.

On every pass, move your seating position a bit. Have someone take pictures.

After that you compare the pictures and where you have to sit to come close to the intended waterline/ best trim.
You also look at the wave patterns that you generate in each position.

Once you decided where your sweet spot is, you just try how the boat behaves in different conditions.

It is quite dificult/impossible to have a good leg drive while your knees are bent too much. I haven't heard about leg drive that much among OC paddlers, while it is considered extremely important in kayaking or rowing.
The reason maybe that here surfing/down wind runs are considered the 'true art' of OC 1 paddling and you probably need leg drive a little less for that.


#46 Sun, 02/04/2007 - 10:17am


This became a really interesting string .. Thank you all for the suggestions .. the humor and waddever .. I am not too much a fool to pay for a new canoe until I have tried out a number, but I wanted input into the most likely "good" candidates, and I got that. All of you enjoy the water and I'll see ya out there .. ALOHA Vytas


#47 Wed, 02/07/2007 - 3:33am


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