Last month I herniated 3 disks in my neck (C4/5 C5/6 C6/7) The C6/7 disk was herniated 6mm. Last week I recieved an epidural. Most of the pain in my right arm is gone, with pockets of minor pain remaning in my pec, rhomboid, lat and hand. Strength and feeling has yet to return to right hand. The doctor who performed the epidural says I can never paddle competitevly again, and perhaps not at all, nor surf or lift with out risk of paralysis. Has anyone else suffered this type of injury and been told the same but has since paddled without negative consequences? If so, how did you do it and how long did it take?
Submitted by aquafiend65 on Sat, 11/10/2007 - 7:22am
I had something very similar happen to me except it was my left side that was affected. Rhomboid, triceps, biceps, lat, and shoulder went numb and quit working after I got an injury that damaged the peripheral, and associated nerves that control those muscles. After an MRI and "nerve conductivity test", doctors determined that I suffered 85-90% paralysis to those muscle and that nothing could be done except "wait and see what happens, but your condition is probably permanent". After about a month, my muscles atrophied really bad. Got frustrated with the doctors passive attitude and took it upon myself to develop my own rehab program that included stretching and weight training....it worked. The affected muscles will never be the same as they were, but the brilliant human body will use other muscles to compensate. You WILL paddle again if you want to.
#1 Sat, 11/10/2007 - 8:56am
I have never had a herniation that high. but my L4/L5 is nice and juicy. At least it looked juicy on an MRI screen. I was told not to paddle or surf about three years ago. Up to this point I have not paddled except for the occasional steering while coaching on low intensity runs. I return to surfing for two or three month periods at a time before my back spazzes out again. And when I say surfing I use this term loosely. I do not surf in waves as large as I used to, and I catch about half as many waves as in the past. I have almost resigned myself to not ever paddling hard (competitively) again. I do want to, but I do not wish to deal with the pain, numbness and tingling I receive from paddling.
Things that have not worked: PT, epidural (temporary relief, as in a couple weeks), chiro, acupuncture, yoga, countless hours of stretching, months on light duty at work, etc.
I can say this, Pilates has me feeling the best I've felt in a while so I'm keeping at that to see if it can help in the long run.
I am no expert on herniations, I know nothing about upper spine herniations, and I have no credit. But these are my experiences with one herniated disk.
No Goto, I do not own a pilates studio...
#2 Sat, 11/10/2007 - 11:37am
Aqua,
That's f***ed up. How did you herniate your disk? I don't really know anything about that. Was it paddling related or more of an inherited situation? I know a lot of guy that have had back injuries related to paddling....might be help to others to share what you know about it.
#3 Sat, 11/10/2007 - 5:44pm
The day i did it I was in the gym. I had done a 30 minute erg (rowing machine) piece, then 5 sets on the bench, 4 sets on the bench pull, then as I was in my first set of dips on # 8, I heard/felt a pop. I thought I had pulled a muscle and immediately called my girlfriend who is a chiro and masseuse (yeah I know:-) who through tests diagnosed me to have a bulged or herniated disk. Later the MRI confirmed. FYI, before the injury I was always having shoulder, rhomboid and lat issues. Just nagging little pains that would sometimes interfere with training. Im also tall, 6'5" but ergonomically its a little gys world and I have bad posture that has resulted in spondylosis. My suggestion (actually hers) get the books http://www.amazon.com/Treat-Your-Neck-Robin-McKenzie/dp/0473002094
http://www.amazon.com/Treat-Your-Back-Robin-McKenzie/dp/0959774661
#4 Sat, 11/10/2007 - 7:18pm
Forgot to mention, I tried the McKenzie theory of PT for lower back. It didn't help a whole lot with my back symptoms. But on the positive side it really improved my flexibility, which is supposedly a way to help an ailing back.
#5 Sat, 11/10/2007 - 9:53pm
Hey aqua, I'm not a physician, but I work w/ Neuro and Orthopedic surgeons in a neuro-critical care unit. I have a paddling buddy, in his mid 30's, who had a bad C-spine which it was believed to be a congenital condition. Herniated discs, spinal canal narrowing, etc. He also was given the speech that he risked quadraplegia if he continued his activity w/o intervention. I put him in touch w/ a good neuro and ortho surgeon who fused and decompressed his neck. I KNOW that surgery is not anyones first option. Actually the surgeons I know will try other approaches if they think they will work. In my friends case, these weren't options (though he tried acupuncture, chiropracty, etc...which COULD make matters worst if not done by someone who is highly trained and knows the limitations of the practice). I've contacted him to throw in his 2 cents. Hes doing well now...about a year and a half after the surgery. He has some limitations in his neck movement, however he is back to paddling, lifting, etc. Of course he's to avoid high impact risks like snowboarding, surfing in big waves, etc. My advice..get other opinions from surgeons, etc. I know some people (my dad for instance) who have had good results w/ epidurals, nerve blocks, etc. However, if your neck is in bad shape, surgical intervention may be your best option. My 2-cents.
#6 Sun, 11/11/2007 - 4:13am
As a 'rule of thumb':
when you have spinal cord injuries the first thing to go is nerve function like sensation, temperature, touch etc.
When you have impact on motor neurons, responsible for muscle movement, the injury is generally more severe.
The unfortunate thing is that you cannot reverse nerve damage, the nerve tissue does not have the ability to recover.
That means whenever you have loss of muscle function it is an emergency, the nerves have to be decompressed within hours to regain function. So do not 'wait and see'.
With sensory nerve problems it may or may not be emergent, but the same rules apply, the nerves do not recover.
Once you had an injury, you want to make sure things do not get worse. A specialist will be able to tell you whether surgery is the advised option.
For recovery, all sorts of rehab are helpful, even though you rather recruit other muscles to help out; there is no way yet to cure damaged nerves.
This is a rather general statement; details of the injury and treatment may vary a lot from person to person. It has to be judged by a specialist.
#7 Sun, 11/11/2007 - 8:32am
aloha Aqua,
if you are in Oahu, TOM DABOSS is the man, he lives up PUPUKEA on the NORTH SHORE, he is a specialist and very efficient CHIROPRACTIC.
give him a call.
#8 Mon, 11/12/2007 - 4:19am
I injured my back when i was 17 and have lived in the terror of when is it going to go out again. till this year a old lady said cold water hot water so i tried ice every time it would worn me it was coming or even tired i would lay on a block of ice with a cloth between us and it kept the swelling down which makes the muscle seize up and this year is the best as far as my back goes
#9 Mon, 11/12/2007 - 7:03am
dad of a friend of mine recently flew from oahu to florida to go to a surgeon who specializes in laser surgery. i guess they make a small incision and go in with a laser and slice off the edges of the herniated disk.... supposedly better than fusion for obvious reason.. it's outpatient, amazing as that sounds. why florida?- he said that this was the only place that has it so far.
i hear he feels much better, but since this is your neck/back, if this is of interest, you should do research, and not go off my hearsay... it sounded interesting to me anyways.
#10 Mon, 11/12/2007 - 7:48am
I've ruptured one lumbar disc and one cervical disc (not at the same time). The lumbar was more serious. I had surgery (laminectomy sp?) and an excellent outcome. The neck was not a severe rupture but it has been a nagging problem. OC-1 doesn't bother me but if I paddle long in OC-6 I experience some pain and weakness in my right tricep and lat.
I can't image 3 disc, you must have been in terrible pain until the epidural. Everyone is different and every disc rupture or herniation disc is different. No offense to the docs but they like to think they are 100% right when it comes to treatments and prognosis but they can only give you an educated opinion. Get a couple of those educated opinions before you make a decision.
#11 Mon, 11/12/2007 - 9:11am
I had 5 disc go bad on me. c2-c7. The discs were impacting the spinal cord as well as the vertebrae were narrowing. I had 60-80 percent muscle loss on my right side. I did everything I could think of to avoid surgery but was not able to in the end. I fused 5 vertebrae together. At the time it was the only option left to me. However they have developed and are currently testing a new disc replacement. It might be an option worth checking out. In any case about 4-5 months later I started paddling lightly again. My doctor told me I had no restrictions other than snow boarding, surf greater than head high, boxing and the like. I competed this year (paddling), but have not gotten back to where I was. Hopefully that will happen this coming season. Let me know if you have any questions that I might be able to answer.
Neal
n_hilo@yahoo.com
#12 Tue, 11/13/2007 - 1:58pm
Neal, your article was inspirational. I am currently suffering multi disk herniations and doing the "wait and see" routine. I have already had C 6/7 fused a few years ago and after all the wait-and-see is over I anticipate a C 5/6 and C 4/5 will be fused as well. My neurosugeon does not put much faith in the artificial disks holding up well to an active lifestyle but this may still be an option. Good to hear that there may be paddling life after multiple fusions though. All situations are different and I worked hard with my physio. to recover from the first fusion so I need all the help possible to get through this again. Don't hesitate to offer any other words of wisdom, Any insites into what life is like with a neck that doesn't rotate.
Mahalo,
Doug
#13 Tue, 11/13/2007 - 7:29pm
Last February I discovered I had herniated disc, pinch nerve, and some sort of arthritis in my neck. The pain was in my mid back but the doctor said it was derived from my neck. I began rehab. Couldn't lift above my head. Couldn't feel my middle, index, and thumb.Tingling and loss a lot of strength in my arm.Traction wasn't doing nothing. Popped pain killers that didn't even work. Painful sleeps. Got depressed. Questioned whether I would ever get better. Doctor said don't do any lifting or paddling for a month. Went to Bale to get a sandwich during lunch. Saw a little boy in a wheel chair moving the thing around with his mouth. Felt like a punk and a wimp. After work went home got my canoe and went paddle. Was sore, I was weak, and I was slow. One of the best runs I ever had. Continued to paddle. Everytime sore or bummed just thought about people that got it worse. Didn't always work but helped. Eventually got a corisone shot that everyone said not to. Helped little bit. Five days later did the hardest race of my life (molo solo 07 HOT AND FLAT). Finished. After that I been getting little bit better. Arm still weak. Fingers tingling now not always numb. Then I read all these storys and I am reminded again at how minor my problems are compared to others. Now I feel like a punk and a wimp. I guess I going paddle.
Mahalo!
#14 Wed, 11/14/2007 - 1:54pm
Maybe another thought here: I feel that computer work at a screen put quite a strain on your neck. So if you do that a lot, some sort of training to strengthen and balance your shoulder girdle, neck, may be helpful to prevent issues.
I myself had serious pain in that area, tingeling etc. Finally got an MRI, the doc smiled at me, showed ne the pictures and said nothing wrong. That very moment the pain went away. There was something about the way he reassured me. Thus, tension makes a difference, too.
#15 Thu, 11/15/2007 - 12:30pm
Thanx for all the feed back and encouragement. I thought I was improving but woke to the other arm going numb. Probably not a good sign. Im kinda over the whole thing though. I just wanna paddle!!
#16 Fri, 11/16/2007 - 2:40pm
Pretty sure there was some other discussion on here a while ago about arms going numb while sleeping. I think another cause of this was from the muscles running up the side of the neck being tense around the nerves that run there. Don't quote me on that though.
I was having problems like that till I tried the stretches someone suggested on the forum and the numbness went away. I'll endeavor to find it... I would try to describe how to do it but I'd screw it up.
#17 Fri, 11/16/2007 - 2:53pm
I feel ya bro...I have been receiving spinal decompression therapy in mesa, az... I recommend seeking some kind of non-invasive therapy before surgery.
#18 Fri, 08/22/2008 - 8:53pm
I suffered a neck injury after getting lipped across the forehead at Hanalei.Saw stars and had temporary loss of leg movement. I made the mistake of going to a chiropractor who applied pressure to the disk and really screwed me up. My legs felt like mush and I could not surf or paddle for three years. I still cannot look up for extended periods of time and have to knee paddle in order to surf. When I am in a canoe I bend my head down . I found that the best therapy was yoga and have been able to slowly get the disk to realign and not pinch the nerves.Also neck strengthening exercises so the neck muscles better support the disk. A much better solution then surgery.
My advice- physical therapy including home use of a head sling to pull the disks slightly apart, neck strengthening excercises, yoga and time will get you back in the water. DO NOT GO TO A CHIROPRACTOR !!!
#19 Sat, 08/23/2008 - 7:41am