I'm baffled why the whole paddling world hasn't revolted yet against the idea of racing OC-1s in the winter and spring.
I don't even care anymore about the ridiculousness of trying to be in top shape at two opposite ends of the year, I'm just sick of paddling in the dark and cold. If we all agreed to put our paddles down between November and February, i think that we'd all be warmer and happier people.
Submitted by luke on Wed, 12/24/2008 - 6:58pm
Hallelujah dang right luke, obviously I mean that in a secular way :)
#1 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 7:58pm
Maybe our secret is that we have to be in top shape at two opposite ends of the year... think about it. Seriously !
#2 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 8:23pm
painteur - no way - 'Halleluja' is by no means secular. :)
#3 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 9:22pm
isn't secular that stuff that comes with the worm in the bottom of the bottle? i'm there.
one step ahead of you luke. it's even easier to just not paddle year round and be out of shape all the time.
#4 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 9:26pm
I'd be stoked on races in the summer. But I think the season would have to be in addition to the winter season. Otherwise people will have to choose between 6 man and 1 man but if they choose 6 man in the summer they can still race 1 man in the winter but those of us who don't do 6 man can race both seasons.
#5 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 10:05pm
I don't think anybody is going to agree to "put down" their paddle in the off months. It's just a fact of life, to be a top paddler, it's a year round commitment.
Seems foolish to even suggest to people that they should train less so you can be warmer....that's pretty funny actually.
Let's try that with all sports. Only train for 2 months before your event, that way it won't be so hard on people.....
#6 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 10:17pm
but if we all agree... then we can all be warm and avoid paddling in the dark.
and i can definitely give a hellelu to YHWH for warmth in wintertime.
#7 Wed, 12/24/2008 - 10:28pm
Warm late afternoon breezes, everyone in good sprits with warm water and the extra long days. What could be better ?
San Diego 2006 - 2007 :
I contacted everyone I knew and / flyerd -on-windshield every one else with racks for two years in a row simply asking them to get back to me with any input for interest in a summer series ... other than Keith Keillor of Valhalla Surfskis, I got Z E R O response ... sigh ...
Any Big Island guys reading with interest .. I still want to put my time into this ... please email or call me anytime.
paddlesho@hotmail.com
961.1818
#8 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 12:17am
You people need to move to New England where we only race in Spring Summer and Fall .
#9 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 2:36am
Yeah, I couldn't figure this one out ;> Why don't they race in the summertime? Does everyone switch to OC-6 or SUP or something? We do OC-1, OC-6 and Dragonboat (I know, the horror ;>) spring, summer and fall. Then we pretty much put the boats away for the winter (I am in withdrawal... been looking at drysuits so that I can still go out if I can get my hands on an OC-1).
#10 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 2:50am
I have it figured out, don`t know why I didnt see this before.
The reason the Hawaiians race one man in winter is because they don`t want to race the east coast paddlers when they are in shape in the Summer.
#11 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 2:55am
in shape...out of shape...
it makes no difference.
#12 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 7:14am
Alright onnopaddle. Money does it. I'm willing to commit $ 500 for the purpose of having a summer SoCal OC1 racing series. It can be spent on prize money, organizing, you name it.
Anybody else?
#13 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 8:37am
I`ve invested hundreds of thousands of dollars in east coast Summer time racing , anyone else want to jump in here to help out is more than welcome .
#14 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 9:04am
I understand that in NorCal, the Wavechaser Series is year round. A winter series that starts in October and runs through March. Then a Summer Series with 3 downwind runs in June, July and August. On top of that, they put on one of the largest Surfski races on the mainland in September.
Pretty impressive series over there. Wish I could attend all of their events.
#15 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 9:27am
It'll never happen, but the coast of Washington and the Strait of Juan de Fuca have the conditions for some sick downwind racing in winter. Check out this marine forecast, it's like that all the time, usually windier. http://i90.atmos.washington.edu/ferry/Ferryjs/mainframe1.htm
#16 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 9:45am
I think this is all part of Lukes devious plan to undermine regatta season because he doesn't like to have to sit all day waiting for his one race. Besides, it's cold sitting on the beach........in Hawaii.........in the summer.........
Dude, seriously, if you're too cold paddling in the evening/night in Hawaii............waaaaahh.
I'll grant you that the racing season is kinda ass backwards as far as conditioning goes. How about 1 man and distance season happening simultaneously and then going into sprint/regatta when everyone is in top shape?
#17 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 11:27am
Gracious thanks Painteur,
Just wanted to start with informal, everyone show up @ the same place and time kind of thing then do sort of an organized run ( on a course that everyone does in training anyway ) but keep track of times. Simple points system with prizes to come.
Not up there anymore.
#18 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 11:58am
wow confuzie, hundreds of thousands? so you mean somewhere between $100K and $900K, wish i had that kind of cash to spend on a self professed hobby.
damn it, i gotta get back to working overtime...
#19 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 12:47pm
You never heard me say it was a cheap hobby.
#20 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 12:49pm
You don't happen to have any spare $ for a plane ticket to NY Mayors Cup 2009 do you Fuzey?
Ramboscie
#21 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 2:25pm
No , but I have a nice boat for you to paddle once you get here and lots of aloha and hospitality here on the Maine coast.
#22 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 2:30pm
That one was for the Missus, mines already locked in, she really wants to experience the Big Apple while i'm trying to commit suicide on the Hudson.
Rambo
#23 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 3:03pm
I originally started this thread because i was cold, but now that i'm warm and my brain is functioning a little better.... Imagine what we could do with a summer series.
I've posted it probably half a dozen times before, but i'm going to post it again.
There could be one association that runs all of the races. We could start racing in May or so, and then have races (OC-1, V-1, V-3, and OC-6) every other weekend or so. They could start off short (in all disciplines) and get progressively longer. We could still have like two regattas in the summer... but no more than that. Everyone would be in pretty good shape by the end of August for the Super Aito, then in September could be the OC-1 Solo Moloka'i (or Maui-Moloka'i-O'ahu) then we'd have a solid month to taper and work only on the OC-6 for the iron Moloka'i Hoe and the Hawaiki Nui.
If we were to get rid of the regatta season we'd have like 12 extra weekends to have better races and plenty of time to have a unified OC-1, V-1, and OC-6 season. Even if we raced only every other weekend from the middle of May through October, that's 12 potential races, six large OC-1 races and six OC-6 races seems like enough to me.
In my opinion, the benefits of compressing the season like that are:
1) We can train more efficiently and hopefully be competitive with the Tahitians again.
2) There will be more international competition from cold places.
3) More people will participate in the OC-1 races because it's warm, light out, and hopefully OC-1ing will be encouraged from the OC-6 clubs.
4) One governing body will have more power to put on better races, retain large sponsors, get more state support, unify the calendar between islands better, and potentially start a rating system to rank clubs and individuals that could be the start of professionalism in paddling.
5) There will be more youth and novice retention in the sport by eliminating regattas and getting them more involved in ocean racing.
6) There would be less burn-out among paddlers who compete in all disciplines because they would have a true off-season to recover and then work on base again.
But for now... I'll continue to paddle in the dark and the cold because in the end, it's still very worth it and it's still an awesome sport no matter what.
#24 Thu, 12/25/2008 - 9:21pm
You know that you're not going to get rid of regatta season, too much heritage. Any changes to OC-6 are going to be unbelievably difficult if not impossible due to the conservatism of the governing bodies.
At the same time if someone stepped up and put on summer OC-1 races, for sure paddlers would show up. There would probably be stink from the regatta contingent, but numbers would tell what paddlers wanted.
#25 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 6:36am
Why not just have the Summer oc1 races on Saturdays? As far as competing w/ the Tahitians, I don't think anything at the organizational level is going to change that. It'll be up to individual paddlers and clubs to train that hard. A big time sponsor would help, too.
#26 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 6:50am
Is outrigger canoeing heritage linked to the rowing regattas that were the predecessor to our regattas? I think that the uniqueness of paddling comes from racing in the ocean, not sprinting in the flat water.
I think that the season, as it is organized, is not conducive to being in top shape in October. So while it's still up to the clubs and the paddlers to train hard and correctly, the season as it is organized doesn't make it very easy. RIght now I think that you'd have to almost give up on the OC-1 and regatta season in order to try and peak for the Moloka'i Hoe.
#27 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 7:55am
Organize a few races in the summer Luke and you'll get a turnout. Try to find a free weekend or day thewre isn't an OC6 regatta. I know it is hard to do on Oahu as you have two OC6 groups but there must be some free Saturdays or Sundays. Would be great to do a north shore run. Summer races in SoCal are the way to go as well. Something where one could have fun with some wind. I imagine a run from Malibu to LA Harbor -Cabrillo or Alamitos Bay/Long Beach could be fun as I recall the winds come up in the afternoon there. Some OC6 clubs do OC1/OC2 races in the summer as fundraisers and see a good turnout. Depends on the effort an organizer wants to put into it. Usually a beer company will help with some beer- and thats all you need to have a good excuse. And the family members who don't paddle can enjoy the beach!
#28 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 7:59am
You just gotta go ahead and get it done Luke, If you wait till everyone agrees its the right thing to do , you` ll be waiting forever.
You can take a weekend , get the word out about your race , hopefully have some good prizes , cash always brings out the best and you will have people show up . I think many people are thinking like you are on this topic.
Call your race the Kamanu series or whatever you like , if it flies , you have a winner , if not then at least you will have learned something.
#29 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 8:25am
How much oc1 time does Shell get in leading up to Molokai? I was under the impression that they trained almost exclusively in the v-6 in the last few months of preparation. How is an oc1 season just before the Hoe going to help people peak for an oc6 change-out race?
#30 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 8:31am
It can help by getting more OC1/OC-2 paddlers together that are already in shape/training who can probably form a team for the Molokai Hoe. Some OC-6 clubs don't do or have a crew to do Molokai, but they have some dedicated paddlers that do OC-1/OC-2 paddling after the regular regatta season.
By having some individual races they could interact with more paddlers outside their clubs and they could form a strong crew that could get together to train for the Hoe. Team Pa'a came in 7th in this years Molokai Hoe and they were formed from a bunch of paddlers from all over the state.
#31 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 9:56am
jim, i think super aito (V-1) is in august.
hawaiki nui is october.
so they are fairly close. i guess train for the aito, then transition to V-6 after that?
#32 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 1:51pm
Would paddlers on Maui be interested in an Independence Day OC-1 race? That's generally the bye-week for OC-6 paddling, and what better way to celebrate Independence Day than paddling independently?
We could do a race course that we don't do during the MCKC season, such as a Molokini Challenge from Kamaole I Beach, around Molokini to Makena Landing (very challenging if there's any wind). Or, something along the lines of Maliko to Napili Bay (excellent surfing, but can be big and perhaps too long for novices). Or, for something really different, we could do an OC-1 fishing tournament.
Suggestions, anyone? Interest anyone?
#33 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 2:58pm
Is there big surf on the north side of Maui during July, or just wind chop, dmehling?
#34 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 3:21pm
Generally no "real" surf on the north side during summer, but we get the standard 6-8' wind swells, as long as the trades are blowing.
#35 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 3:23pm
"Standard 6-8' wind swell" hummmm is that overhead or double overhead?
#36 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 3:34pm
We race oc1 all winter long and get our butts kicked in the last month with all the big races, its kind stupid if you think about it. Lets say you have a five month race season where you start races in April and finish in the beginning of Sep/ late Aug. You can have your big Four race spread out in May(Maui to Molokai Challenge). June (Kaiwi Channel Relay). July (Kauai World Challenge). August (Kaiwi OC1 World Championship (PA'A)) Vs this race schedule.
April 9-12 – Kauai World Challenge
APRIL 19 – Kaiwi OC1 World Championship (PA'A)
April 25 – Maui to Molokai Challenge
May 3rd – Kaiwi Channel Relay
You can also set up each of the series races in-between all of the big Four. This set up would allow everything Luke mentioned above with the spread of the sport. Look I think regattas are fun from a spectator stand point but the fact of the matter is open ocean racing is where the sport separates itself from others.
#37 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 3:51pm
starting in Feb. would give enough time to train correctly for the big 4, however the regatta season, boring as it can be, brings up the na opio & novices, not to mention a brake between the OC1 and OC6 distance seasons, and regattas are a gathering place for family in friends. It also gives coaches and staff time to work with their inventory of paddlers that hopefully stay for OC6 distance races.
So I guess just peak for the big 4 and not the early races?!?
#38 Fri, 12/26/2008 - 4:40pm
Im not saying get rid of the regattas, I do kinda like them. I am saying do them all at the same time. And how would training on one mans get in the way of six mans. I thought they built one mans so that you could train for six man.
How many of us have done a full one man season and then the solo finished and stepped right into the six man with out giving time to recover. Paddling 11 months out of the year can be fun but you cant do it all, you just get burnt out.
Has anyone thought that maybe Regattas are the reason novice don't stick with the sport, you can have all the family and friends you want but if you only get to race once an entire day then it kinda sucks.
#39 Sat, 12/27/2008 - 6:56am
In Vancouver Canada when it warms up,we have a Tuesday and every second Thursday night night race for singles. we get 40 to 80 even moor sometimes. I love them you show up race and go out for dinner start at 5 and finished by 10. they have door prizes and BBQ. I enjoy them as much or moor than our regatta season. My hands are up to the organizers of them I know they are a lot of work.
#40 Sun, 12/28/2008 - 10:18am
hey mulus.... sounds fun, a good way to get intervals in while having fun with friends and eat!
:)
#41 Sun, 12/28/2008 - 4:36pm
Thanks . They are held by Pogue sports and Deep cove Kayaking. the runs are 7 to 12k and they are different every time and they tell you 20 min before they start.if you are ever in Van come try one.
#42 Sun, 12/28/2008 - 7:33pm
Give us some dates that does sound like a fun way to race. A few years ago Lanakila was having weekly time trials to help choose there Molo team, the TT were similar with it was close to 8 miles and they changed the course to match the wind.
#43 Tue, 12/30/2008 - 10:54am
They start in April or May and go all summer.
http://www.deepcovekayak.com/rental-and-lessons/racing/
http://www.bigchop.ca/blog.htm
#44 Tue, 12/30/2008 - 12:34pm
Regattas are perfect for introducing kids and novice paddlers to paddling. Considering Long Term Athlete Development, age 10-12 is a perfect time for kids to start paddling. How else would we provide structured coaching and racing opportunities for these thousands of people entering our sport? Maybe the seasons could be reorganized a bit and maybe the regatta rules could be changed so these short course races are more time efficient and fun. In Hawaii, we are so fortunate that we can be on the water every day of the year.
So, keep innovating, Luke, but also keep in mind that regattas serve many worthy purposes.
#45 Sat, 07/03/2010 - 3:36pm
It has been tried and done before a long long time ago before the days of one-man's when surfskis poai puni Oahu. Turn-out was small, but outrigger clubs promised support during the winter months and actually sponsored races as attendance grew. Many years later, OC-1s continued the winter racing as we know it today. It may be winter to us, but Down Under it is summer. Trying to keep in shape during the summer and even maintaining junior crews is difficult, for that is the time most families travel. Perhaps we should take up what Fuzerider says and go race in his land of lobster pounds, clambakes, brew and ice cream during the summer? Imagine racing in the night while the sun is still shinning! All the lobster you can eat is worth it.
#46 Wed, 07/07/2010 - 12:56pm
Pa'a & Kanaka Ikaika, or someone. Great ideas here.
#47 Mon, 06/27/2011 - 4:30pm