Here we go again.
Na Wahine O Ke Kai-Women’s Molokai
Last year I posted-
"Team Bradley will be challenged by a very, very hungry Team Hui Lanakila and Waikiki Beach Boys. I am sure there are some other women’s teams in Hawaii who want to fly under the radar before Molokai but who are also looking for respect on race day. Also we have to consider an Australian, California, or Canadian All-Star Team showing up. I am not in the know, but others might know if they are coming or not."
It looks like things are shaping up the same way with a few differences.
Hui Lanakila has picked up different ladies and are using a Bradley-Lightening. Also I wonder if Team Bradley has been playing a little “Cat and Mouse” by taking it easy on prep races. We will see soon. It should be amazingly close and a great race.
Molokai Hoe-Men’s Molokai
Things are different this year. Tahiti (Shell, OPT, etc) have dominated the last two years and have left Hawaii more than a little shocked and shaken. Coaches across Hawaii started the change stroke rate talk, grabbed a single or double bend paddle, and upped training. We will see.
Lanikai has jumped to the challenge and has called all of the “family” to come back together. It will be interesting. Other crews in Hawaii are looking to step up too and prove they are also strong. PAA, Hawaiian, Kailua, Outrigger
LiveStrong Masters will be in the Masters mix. Australia will have to watch out.
I have heard a few and not totally confirmed but.
What type of canoe (New Mirage or Bradley-Lightening) will Lanikai choose for Molokai? Hmmm.
Submitted by Kona J on Wed, 09/24/2008 - 8:16am
In today's Advertiser, regarding Team Bradley. They are clearly the team to beat, having won the last three years in a row. Unreal. (Buy Advertiser!!)
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 8:28am
I hear that there is a novice team from Seattle, WA coming down for their first Molokai Hoe. From what I heard out of the nine paddlers only two are experienced (one paddler and the other a Hawaiian steersman). The rest have LESS than one year experience paddling Outrigger. They have been rigorously coached from none other than goto himself. It might be interesting to see just how well they do...
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 8:31am
Go get 'em gurl!
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 8:32am
Last year had 82 crews finish the race- this year 69 crews signed up at this time-meaning might end up with 72 or so by race day. Down about 10 crews from last year. I was wondering how economy and travel would play into this.
Last year men had 114 crews I guess that will dip too
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 9:07am
The big teams will always show up, whether they are as good or better than previous years is going to be the question.
Molokai hoe you know the Tahitians are going to be strong, that is the given.
Australia will more than likely have a good/ great team.
Hawaiian teams have been pushing themselves since last years race and are sure to come up with something amazing. Numerous teams that have yet to show all of their cards are going to be surprising people left and right.
California will show up again this year with another strong Lanakila team. Choosing to step up in every department, they have recruited guys that they think will get the job done.
Canada is somewhat of the mystery competitor this year. I haven't heard of anything coming from them, but that just means that I don't know if they are sending a crew.
Given that this year we will have an incoming tide the whole way across the channel we could very well again see another record breaking crossing. Remember that the fast teams will always be fast, its the teams that choose a good course and have a great race that will be the ones that surprise us the most.
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 11:55am
CANADA is sending a molokai crew
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 12:26pm
Tahiti will continue their domination. Maybe if it's SUPER windy, and Jr. remains part of the team, Lanikai will challenge Shell/OPT etc. I'd be extremely surprised if a North American crew finishes in the top ten. As for the Seattle guys...I hope Parfait brings his "water wings"!
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 2:46pm
Every tahitian paddler supports Shell Va'a... except OPT paddlers !
Go Shell ! Bring that trophy home !
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 8:33pm
" and Jr. remains part of the team, " Is he not?
Wed, 09/24/2008 - 9:22pm
Ed, it's probably not a big secret, but my sources tell me Jr. is refusing to race the channel in a Bradley. He really doesn't like those Eagle-head amas, I guess.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 1:36am
i dont belive my eyes.....!!!!
even if i'am not Hawaiian, even if i am not a Lanikai member, i truly wish they win over Tahiti this year.
to read your comment Jim, about Jr not willing to ride a Bradley, gives me Brain-damage, not because who or what, because the lack of UNITY........
WIN 'EM WITH DA KOA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 2:37am
Would Bill Gates advertise for Macintosh?
Would Lance ride anything but a Trek?
If not , then why would Jr. paddle anything other than a Mirage?
In my book loyalty trumps unity everytime.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 3:00am
with all my respect to you, loyalty to your club, to your teammates yes of course.
i understand your book, however, this is not only Marketing we are talking about, and Jr is one in a team of nine paddlers, so by no means he racing the Bradley would damage OC reputation. plus it seems that everybody on Lanikai first crew did their share of sacrifice to challenge 2 times champions Shell Va'a.
i would agree with you if you are talking about an OC-1 race......but this is OC-6.... paddling as one.............you have to stick to the only book this tradition carries Fuze......UNITY.
we all know your love to OC, but please dont compare apples to orange.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 3:13am
Well, I `m sure the team will be unified once they decide what boat they want to run.
And not only that but, if I had Jr. willing to steer my boat and he said we`re going with a Mirage my response would be " yes sir , what color do you require....
Any of you people paying attention to Wall Street these days??
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 5:36am
I agree Fuzzy. If Jr wants his team to go slower in a Mirage, that's his business. Loyalty RULES!
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 5:35am
Do you have word on exactly which Tahitians teams are coming and how many? What are thoughts in Tahiti about the race this year?
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 5:43am
I've been looking EVERYWHERE for water wings, but I can't find any. If you happen to come across the pair I borrowed from you last time, let me know!
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 6:59am
when people paddle for a club, people make decisions as a club. a club is a family, and its what makes hawaii paddling programs so special
like kekoa said before, "your only as good as your worst paddler"
i think you should stop worrying about buisness and what product sells, instead worry about yourself and just paddling
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 8:47am
For me , being a canoe dealer is just a hobby , in Hawaii it probably could be called a business but, out here at the end of the road in Maine , it`s definitely a hobby.
I hope to see lots more oc paddlers out here in the future .
Really makes no difference to me what they paddle as long as they get out on the water and have some fun.
Ryan , you are a hell of a good paddler , when you need a Fuze please call me first , I`ll make sure you get what you need .
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:03am
Well said Ryan...
This isn't about selling boats. It's about winning as a team and making sacrifices to challenge very formidable competitition. I don't think he had any contingencies when he returned to Lanikai. He wanted to WIN. Not come back to Lanikai to "win with a Mirage" Maybe he should tell his Dad to take a look at the Bradley and retool his boat. Now, I'm sure they tried with the "newest" mirage, but, from what I understand, it doesn't quite perform as well. Okay, fine. Try again next year.Jr and Sr. would get more respect if he went with the 1st crew, gave it their best effort. But, I think they're moving on and now, someone else will get a shot with the 1st and fastest crew and a CHANCE to be our Hawaii Champions.
Hard to sell thoroghbreds when you driive/ride a clydesdale.People can see for themselves
Oh, just my opinion, I think the fuze sucks...
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:21am
Either you agree or you disagree. Both are respectable positions.
Generally, it may be a wise choice to excuse yourself from a situation when you foresee a conflict and don't see how to resolve it at that moment.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:32am
I am curious why if team unity is such a sticking point on nailing JR, why doesn't the team use a mirage? I have not agreed with much of what Fuze has said here lately but I do agree on this point, Put yourself in Jr's shoes, This is a tough market and winning is everything, This is not as simple as being a "team" rider, This is his job and more importantly his family's business.
This forum is choked with the phrase "it's the engine not the boat". So why is it so important to race a Bradley?
One could make the argument that the Lightneen is a faster Hull, But if Jr has not put a lot of time in the boat steering it and knowing the boats characteristics like he knows a Mirage, He would in fact make the boat run slower than what he could do in a Mirage.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:55am
I agree with OceanOhana. Jr knows the Mirage. He has every right as a steersman to have a say in which canoe they race. Knowing that OC is his family business, I would be very surprised to see him racing in the competition canoe. Even if the Bradley is better... is it really that much better? Have they been compared 1 to 1 with the same crew? I doubt it could be so much better to trump the steersman's comfort and knowledge of the canoe he is guiding across the channel.
No conflict here... I just steer whatever they will let me.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 10:01am
Wow some great points here.
First of all, man of use are making the ASSumption that the bradley is faster. Do we know that for a fact?
BUT maybe Jrs been practicing in it and we don't know. But I somehow doubt 2 months in the bradley can make up for years in a mirage.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 10:11am
I think it will be fun to see how the second crew will do with Jr steering them! I think if I were in that crew I would be so excited and who knows, maybe this will be a race to really watch them.
As a marketing person, I totally understand why Jr is doing what he is doing. I also know that the lanikai men understood and respect what he is doing.This didnt just happen and it was well discussed prior.
As a TV person, I think this years Molokai hoe is going to be the best yet, not just for the racing, but the behind the scene stuff. I have heard about a few teams coming in from the mainland, and Canada that are looking really good.
Good luck to all of you who are racing.
Ocean Paddler TV
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 10:53am
This is the first I have heard of the lightning being preferred over mirage in the channel. Maybe the Tahitians decision to use Lightning has made other crews take a second look.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:14am
...I think we'll be seeing a flash of lightning cross the finish line first on Sunday.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:19am
From the rumor I heard...Lanikai used both the Mirage and Bradley and they paddled from Moloka'i. Same crews switching out and the exact same conditions. This is what I heard made the team decide the way they did.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:23am
didn't hui lanakila make the switch also? i think hawaii/nz did last year also...
i heard that the tahitians tested both canoes upwind, sidewind, downwind before making the decision...yeah, they would have won in either boat, but they also had a choice, and their choice DOES say something. if nothing else- THEY could paddle it faster. but i did hear from a biased source, so who knows.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:36am
yes, we will be paddling leighton's canoe, a bradley --- "lehuuila no kalawai'a" the flash of lightning for the fisherman....
yes, team hi/nz was in a bradley lightning last year, as well.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:43am
This thread is stressing me out too much , I`m going paddling now to burn off a little steam ....
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 12:26pm
Sorry to all who were disturbed/offended by my "revelation"! Ha-ha, I figured if a guy in Warshingtun knows then everyone else must know already, too, right? Frankly, I don't see the problem w/ disseminating the info. Why shouldn't the OCpaddler people be privy to this development? Does the information somehow jeopardize Lanikai's chance of victory? What's the fucking problem? If something similar happened on a pro sports team it would be all over the news.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 1:23pm
im pretty sure this all about perspective. we should really understand the view of both partys. is there some way we can satisfy both partys needs as far as marketing, and using the better boat? could it be that most of it is a mental thing? seeing as the tahitians have been winning in bradleys, im pretty sure it has alot of influence on the teams decision. I do not blame nor judge anyone, and neither should anyone else here. i hope i do not offend
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 3:14pm
Dude, if you're not offending someone, you're doing it wrong. ;)
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 3:42pm
I too, used to think that the Mirage was a faster canoe. Since Ra'i won a few years ago, followed by HI/NZ the next,( i think).Then, in '05, the first two canoes were Bradleys, the third was a Mirage w/ Tahitians in them, then 4th was OCC in a Mirage. '06, I'm not sure, but, last year HI/NZ went with a Bradley, and that was unheard of as those boys were pretty loyal followers of karel. But, no Jr. They got 3rd.
Anyway, it's about winning as a crew/club. You're putting the best out there. Pat Irwin and Tommy Connor have done their homework. They don't get commissions for picking the Bradley. They could care less what canoe it is as long as it gives their club the best opportunity to win.They've done the testing.
OC has made a successful business out of oc-6's & oc-1's. I don't think their company will go down the toilet. If anything, they'll come back with a better canoe in the future.
People are trying to grab Lightnings anywhere they can find them. And THAT my friends is the real excitment.
How's this...Paddlers that are looking for sponsorship to help with the costs of oc-1's should look for sponsors other than boat manufacturers. Look into clothing companies etc... That way, you'll pick the boat that you think is truely the best. Without having to butter up the paddlers for that particular boat.I undestand the marketing aspect.Try every boat you can and do as many tests as you can, then make an educated choice best suited for your style. Oh... is that what Lanikai did with the Mirage and Bradley? mah bad
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 4:34pm
both boats were tested in a Moloka'i run. The results showed that the Bradley was faster on that day. Or so I heard.
on another note. Maui is a pretty friggen cool island.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 4:58pm
can we look forward to Italian translations?
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 5:26pm
fact is, its lanikai canoe club, not karel jr canoe club. live and die as a club. brotherhood..........stop lippin and start rippen. hey jim lose some weight and come line up with the big dogs. you talk to much, your days as an OK paddler are done, get over it.
WOKE UP AND SCREAMED FTWorld
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 7:44pm
ftw, awesome, the greatest belittling ever exhibited on this site, long overdue.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 8:07pm
I think the fact so many people are talking about this makes it interesting. This should be a good race, regardless ...how would it be if some other crew wins that noone is talking about!! All the attention is placed on 2 teams right now..There are 100 or so that will be out there. Everyone, all the paddlers are winners. I know that sounds silly, but think about it. I have done this channel a 20 or so times in all sorts of canoes and everytime it is a new experince. My fav of course is in my pink sailing canoe..hahaha
We will be out there filming with 5 or so film guys in the water and up above in the helo's. Hopefully we will get some good footage of everyone:):)
Good luck to all of you. Have a wonderful day out there and take it all in.
Ocean Paddler TV
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 8:22pm
FTW: does that, by any chance, stand for Fuck The World?
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 8:43am
from what i heard, they tested the new mirage but not the old one? curious how the old one does v. the lightning v. the new mirage.
jc9_0, maui non è fantastico. nessun offesa :(
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:11pm
Shell will be there, OPT A too.
I heard of another team composed of OPT B paddlers, Venus Va'a paddlers, steered by Manutea Owen.
Don't know wich other teams will come.
Stop talking about wich canoe Lanikai should paddle. Anyway Shell will cross the finish line first and their canoe will be... a yellow one !
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 9:27pm
Where do I begin? Lanikai owns 5 Mirages, 3 Bradleys and 2 Koa canoes. They have all been extensively tested for the last two years. Each of these canoes, there are 3 generations of Mirages, 3 generations of Bradleys, and numerous modifications to the Koa's, have individual characteristics that can produce excellent results in specific conditions. Any prudent coach will assess which canoe will perform in the conditions of the current race on the schedule. The last remaining race on the schedule is Molokai. We will choose the canoe which is best suited to those race conditions. We will not be flipping a coin. We will know which canoe to use and the crew will be confident with the decision. The crew that is chosen to paddle this canoe will be committed to performing at the highest level with the ultimate goal of winning the race. Enough said.
Tommy Conner, Coach, L.C.C.
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 10:22pm
No one's mentioned Bill Rosehill's canoe yet. Anyone know who is paddling it?
Thu, 09/25/2008 - 11:24pm
I think goto , the canoeless Pueo rider threw the gasoline on the fire to make this thread ignite.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:06am
Aloha Tom Conner,
i really would like to see Lanikai beat Shell Va'a this year.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:55am
Every year the same pattern of behavior emerges at Molokai Hoe.
Hawaiian clubs face off against what essentially is a Tahitian National team.
Why is it that US Outrigger racing is so resistant to fielding a superstar team of ringers to compete representing the United States?
The dragon boaters seem to be able to field national teams and do very well...
Whats more important your club or your country?
Wake up America !!!
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 2:32am
let's not get all nationalistic over this, leave that crap for the Olympics. Hopefully Lanikai can pull it off, if not, its not the end of the world.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 3:03am
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 6:50am
Ahhh, the comaraderie of paddlers. Got to love it.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 5:10am
Tom Connor thank you for your comments and in sight. you continue to be greatly admired and respected. All clubs wish they could grab you for a month or so to have you work with their paddlers,
We are having a this canoe vs. that canoe discussion on a very base level, since different team technique, power phase, stroke rate, paddler size and weight, and steersman ability go into the equation. And for each of these canoes you have to adjust. Can you say on average this canoe is better than that canoe? I think we are close to being able to do that, but probably one or two more years of results will have to go into it. It is what eckhart is trying to do for OC-1's. He now might need to start a new website for OC-6.
Fuze, I wouldn't view Shell as a National Team. They worked very hard and took many years as a club to get to the level they are at and they can't and don't pick and choose who they want to be on their team.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 7:29am
BTW Jim isn't this about the time that you call FTW out to meet you somewhere to discuss things like a man. ;)
If it is, then this thread too is moving into Hall of Fame territory.
The OPT team is made up of employees of the French Polynesia Office des Postes et TÃ©lÃ©communications. The Shell team is made up of employees of the Shell Oil Co. operating in French Polynesia.
The above quote is from Hiro c earlier this year.
Is Shell oil hiring fast paddlers to work for them ? If so , it would seem to me they are more an all star corporate team than a club.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 7:47am
My comment was they are not a national team. I will meet you in the middle and agree they are more a "team" than a "club".
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 8:30am
Great Stuff on this thread...fun reads.
Good Luck Lanikai, PAA, and any other Hawaii team that has an outside chance of beating tahiti. We will need all the speed we can get.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 11:12am
but you gotta admit, that eagle ama is disgusting...
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 12:19pm
You mean this one: ?
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 12:28pm
First the company "Shell" is already "Pacific Petroleum" so the so famous "Shell Va'a" will no longer exist next year. It will become Pacific Petroleum Va'a.....
If you think a little bit outside of the paddling world, and take a better look in the economy over there, you will see that there are no much job/work options....
No doubts, Va'a is the national sport, and kids dream to be the best paddler ever.... so they get out of school and go play with any canoe available to them. But they start to grow up, and realizes that there's a chance to get a "safe job" if they are a great paddler. So they use the paddling as a opportunity to get a good payment out of working for those companies...
Ex.: You're a great paddler and you're from Raiatea.... The Shell Va'a coach (or whoever) calls you and invites you to come paddle for Shell. But Shell is on Tahiti. So the guy has to move to Tahiti, but he has no place to live, or job, or transportation.... So the paddler will negotiate. "Yes, I want to, but I need a job..." I know one that ask for a job, a place to live and a car.... He lived in some kind of basement inside the company, and he got a deal with one of the company's car....
So they sign a contract, it could be just for a year, for X years, or lifetime...
But you only have your job as long as you paddle for them.
There was Heiari Mama case that he didn't work for Shell, but paddle for Shell Va'a....
Since this is the last year they will come for Moloka'i Hoe, I think they will do whatever it takes to cross the finish line first.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:12pm
Shell keeps the same paddlers/employees from year to year. They don't change their team line up.
Call them an all star team if that can make you feel good :-)
From 2006 to 2007 one paddler was different....
Vatea Roopiniapaddle on 2006 but not 2007
Jason Ori and Heiari Mama paddled 2006 and 2007 but won't be paddling this year...
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:49pm
I would go,
Thanks for the information-great detail and insight.
Can you tell me the Shell Va'a Coach's number? cause I think I might just always send it to my voice mail(which is full) and maybe I better pick up his call.
Don't I wish.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:22pm
unfortunately no..... I'm sorry.
Don't worry 'cause if you're good enough and tahitian, he will call you again! =D
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 1:24pm
IwouldGo - its interesting to read more indepths coverage of things happening outside of Hawaii and the crews participating in the race. That was an informative post on the Tahitian crews and the background info!
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 2:33pm
Poopoo and Fuzerider...
kala mai, but Bradley's ama is suppose to be that of the Hawaiian Hawk more commonly called 'io. If I not mistaking, the first (most recently modified) Lightning was called 'Iolana. I believe his Team Bradley girls paddled the 'Iolana at the Liliu race a couple years ago, then it won in the channel with the same boat. 'Iolana in Hawaiian means soaring, soaring like a hawk.
I know, I know, it looks like an Eagle, but in our Hawaiian eyes and in Sonny Bradley's eyes, it is the Hawaiian Hawk!! If ever any of you get a chance to go to the Volcano area, on occasion, you can see the 'io soaring.....beautiful site.
Fri, 09/26/2008 - 2:48pm
Thanks for the good view of the inside of Tahitian paddling.
I`ve got a huge respect for them , and thier paddling abilities.
Kind of primordial , they seem to paddle from the heart....
I like the name of the Hawaiian Hawk , IO .
For lots of years I`ve flown with many hawks while chasing thermals in a hang glider.
When you fly with them , they accept you as though you were a bird and are not affraid.....
Sat, 09/27/2008 - 1:18am
FTW, I knew it was you Kahaku! At least get a few channels under your belt before you start lippin' like that. How's Kahi doin? Love, James Clapp
Sat, 09/27/2008 - 3:00am
New rule here at OCP :
Sat, 09/27/2008 - 3:09am
This thread delivers.
And for what it's worth......whatever you may think of Jim.....this place had gotten very boring in his absence and he is willing to put his name to his posts.
Sat, 09/27/2008 - 5:13am
#1. The Bradley is a Tahitian design. True
2. Lanikai was the first to convert to a Bradley (read Tahitian). Many years ago.
#3. Fuze(maine?)rider, Paddling is a Hawaiian sport. Yea an all-HAWAI'I team would be great. What's this "National" crap/shit?
#4. Dragon-Boaters? I've met many good ones. Just my opinion, most are crybabies and have no "respect" for the "spirit/SOUL" of a traditional boat/canoe.
#5 Kona J, wat u bin smokin?
#6 Tahitians are PROS. They get PAID to paddle. Jobs, cars and cribs/pads.
#7. There was CHEATING going on last year. Saw it with my own eyes.
#8 Mr. Tommy Connor knows what he is doing as does Pat Erwin.
GOOD LUCK to ALL Hawai'i crews......bring it HOME.
BEST OF LUCK to Hui Lanakila Wahines my FAVORITES!!!
Sat, 09/27/2008 - 7:53am
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