The State Sport of Hawai'i

http://www.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/20090613/BREAKING02/90613044/-...

The Hawaii Interscholastic Athletic Directors Association today approved proposals to reduce state tournament participation in most sports. The recommendations will go to the Hawaii High School Athletic Association executive board on Tuesday for final approval.

This morning at Ala Moana Hotel, the HIADA general assembly voted to reduce state tournament participation by 20 percent in golf, swimming, wrestling, track and field, cross country, tennis, judo, bowling, paddling and air riflery.

A proposal to limit team state tournaments to 33 percent of the total statewide participation was also approved, likely shrinking Division II baseball, softball and soccer state tournament fields from 12 teams each to eight.

Division I baseball, basketball and volleyball state tournaments likely would remain at 12 teams under the formula.

The Oahu Interscholastic Association, citing effects from the Department of Education's mandated 50 percent budget cut for athletic supplies, equipment and transportation, submitted most of the proposals related to reduced state tournament participation.

Submitted by HVA on Sat, 06/13/2009 - 7:05pm



Sorry to hear that ...

Poor kids ... both individual AND team ...

Hope you guys can make the best of the more concentrated seasons.

Maybe all the kids can write to Lingle voicing opinions from field level.

aloha,
pog


#1 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 12:13am


Do these morons think they are saving money? Does the Hawaiin State Government know the long term cost of obesity!


#2 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 1:41am


You people who look to the government to support your sports are off course once again!!!

Corporate dragon boating is alive and well all over the world and its` supported mostly from the private sector.

The private sector is where the money is, HELLO!!


#3 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 2:27am


Are you seriously suggesting the private sector would or could or should take over the running of sport in schools. The ramifications of these sort of cost cuts are horrendous, you will get a direct link to a rise in youth crime, suicide, obesity and general wellbeing. It's just a poor decision forced upon them by the Education Dept it seems. I know the recession has hit everywhere but cutting services for a section of the community that haven't got a vote is a low act.


#4 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 5:25pm


yup this is f*cked. this will most definitely increase drug and related crime. with the warm island climate, youths can just cruise and get into all sorts of situations with time on their hands. wow it might even increase youth pregnancies and an increase on the department of welfare!!!!!!


#5 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 8:08pm


Well said Clarkie.
It is during difficult times like this that MORE money needs to be put into getting the excess energy out of our youth, and not limiting their outlet.
Our youth need organized challenges and socialization otherwise they may create their own anti social interaction. The community will pay for this stupid decision many times over.
That 20% savings will cost the community a hell of a lot more.
It is the so called ones that fall through the gaps.
20% X 10 sports is one big hole to fall threw!


#6 Sun, 06/14/2009 - 9:35pm


A tax break for companies that donate to sports is all thats needed to fund sporting activities.

Plain and simple.

You people who think government is the only place to go to get funding for your fun fail to remember that government isn`t a money generatng enterprize.

Too much socialism going on in Hawaii, thatswhy theres no money left for what you want to use it for.

With your kind of thinking, someday you`ll be begging the government for a loaf of bread and wonder why you are not getting one.


#7 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 12:48am


More priceless Ayn Rand lecturing by Fuzie! Awesome! Sometimes I wonder if you sit around trying to decide which part of your customer base you have yet to insult or heap all-knowing righteousness upon.

BTW- Govt. money IS the peoples' money. It was taxed. I think people here are just wanting THEIR money spent on the youth of Hawaii.


#8 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 5:34am


What Fuzerider, You say begging for tax breaks is better than begging our government for bread. If thats the case looks like we are all in trouble. Look out pretty soon they'll start charging a lane, hull and ama tax too. Marara


#9 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 5:44am


No doubt,e02060. Continued faith in the Free Market Gods is astounding at this point in history.


#10 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:30am


Comrade e02060,

Clearly you are not keeping up with current events.

If you think tax dollars will go where you want them to go after they have passed through government hands , you are a simpleton and a dreamer.

Individuals working and making a profit for themselves collectively are what drives the economy.

High taxation is stifling to high productivity.

And, Marara , its not neccessary to "beg" for tax breaks if the people will see the wisdom in electing conservatives to represent them. Conservatives know what truely stimulates the economy and its` not more spending.

Hard for me to educate you people here, go read Liberty and Tyranny by Mark Levin and youll learn what Im talking about.

Mark explains this stuff very well in his book.


#11 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:33am


I realize Fuze's rhetoric may be shocking to an int'l audience of paddlers, and as a fellow American, I apologize. He lives in area of Maine which only recieves signal from FOX news.


#12 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:44am


fuze,
Didn't realize that the "great one" is a paddler.


#13 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 7:24am


The Great One:

http://marklevinshow.com/home.asp

If The Great One were a paddler , he`d be on a Fuze!!


#14 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 8:11am


And I was just saying to myself how boring the threads have become. Thanks Fuze for another injection for your unique and uncanny ability to fire-up the general populace. As to your political and economic viewpoints, well...

The focal point of the thread though is the importance of youth sports and the positive impact it has not only on each individual participant, but the community at large. It is saddening to see that cuts were considered the best option rather than seeking alternative funding or reallocating funds from less popular, less necessary state programs.

But, very recently members of OCpaddler community in conjunction with their local Hawaiian community were successful in halting shark tours. I'm sure your collective voices could have an impact in this situation as well.

We've got our own governmental spending problems here in California, too. But I think in an area where athletics such as paddling are so closely tied to the community and culture as in Hawaii, cutting those programs is not the answer. (Regardless of political affiliation.)


#15 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 8:10am


So what Fuzzrider, Bush is a conservative? They are all crooks, that is why they spend so much money to be elected to a low paying job, right? Paddle not politics.
Marara


#16 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 8:11am


Totally agree with you, six as one, rotten shame that the good stuff gets cut from the budget as the bureaucrats get fatter.

The Tahitians have Shell Oil , maybe someone should contact EXXON and ask nicely for some sponsorship.

How would you people like me to lobby them for a little support? I`d be happy to do it for the paddling community.

They probably speak the same capitalist language that I do so, it would be my pleasure to get it done for you.


#17 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 8:20am


Fuzie! You are so right! I forgot that Bush gave all those companies huge tax breaks and in return they POURED it right back into the community with public programs, health care, and other benevolent acts! In fact, I want to personally thank Halliburton and Exxon for funding my local schools. Their billions in profits have made my world so much better! Yes! And I rest soundly knowing your advice is backed up by the business genius that has made Eastern Outrigger such an international juggernaut of commerce.


#18 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 12:13pm


Up to this point I have resisted jumping on the bash Fuze bandwagon but this is too much. Fuck you and your supply side trickle down reagonomic tax breaks for the rich bullshit that has left this country on the verge of collapse. Fuck you and all your discreditted conservative ideas. Shut the fuck up and keep it on the subject of paddling.


#19 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 2:11pm


Fuzerider,

If the Great One were a paddler, he would paddle up next to you and huli your ama.


#20 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 2:23pm


hey fuze,
its sad to see that you procreated and i hope that you did not instill your personal values in your kid and you let them be free thinkers. if not give them a gun to go and kill other kids because they have different values and beliefs. dont forget to sign them up for rotc so they can fight the wars. its the "conservative way". encourage them to join the military. now dont puss out and make others do your bidding. i know youd be a back seat warrior and talk all this shit about fighting for america and its safety. so dont try to justify it because only the ones who are on the frontlines can say that they protected the country. it is the conservative way to first cut healthcare and education and give it all to the war and halliburton and exxon. oh the hypocricy of it all. it would be hard for you to understand public education and the need for funding. im not tlking about your "conservative public school" but inner city schools. you know where the minority live, people of color. not the one black or asian person who went to your school. have you ever seen that place? not on TV but live? but you would rather help your self than others. its a selfish world we live in and it is because of people like you with your "consrvative" beliefs and values


#21 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 2:59pm


I certainly could not think of somebody more fit to represent the paddling community (a.k.a., "you people") to big business than the messiah of paddling himself. New England missionaries have always done well for the people of Pacific Islands. I can't see any reason why this wouldn't work out splendidly.

I suggest Fuzerider draft a letter to Exxon on behalf of "us people" and post it up for public comment.


#22 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 3:06pm


Private sector sponsorship of High School paddling? Sounds far fetched. The thing you have to realize about Shell/Tahiti sponsorship, Fuze, is that paddling is much more popular there. Furthermore,(and perhaps Hiro can chime in) I believe the guy who sponsors Shell is a local Tahitian, the sponsorship does not come directly from the Shell corp., but from this local owner. Honestly Fuze, how much success have you had finding private sponsorship for something as large as the Hawaiian High School events? Without public funding, such events would disappear. Everything cannot be left to Jesus and Rush Limbaugh. Didn't you notice that the most successful sports programs come from communist countries? Paddlers of the World Unite!


#23 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 3:43pm


verylowtide, well put. Fuckoff Fuzerider.


#24 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 3:48pm


Just got back from a blown out SUP surf session, this is way more fun. Leave for a couple of hours and all hell breaks loose.
Been thinking that OCP has been a bit dreary compared to a couple of years ago. We all need to thank fuze.
Jim, regarding corporate sponsorship of High School paddling, someone told me a story about Castle Corp. giving a couple/three Mirages, trailer etc. to every HS on Oahu. Anything to it?
Obviously the state can pay for athletics, things for kids to do, or they can pay more for law enforcement/ prisons down the road when they have to deal with the results of bored kids with nothing to do.


#25 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 5:27pm


Went over to pacificpaddler.com and read online April edition and article (Ala Wai Challenge) in part about Uncle Bobby and what his group has been doing in face of cut backs to things like park operations and staffing out there where their group is located...nice to know about those efforts out there, at least, and where they are coming from!


#26 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:09pm


Or they could send the bored angry kids to Maine to amuse themselves, be interesting to see what trickles down then.


#27 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:10pm


verylowtide, you really show your ignorance when the best you have to offer is a string of f-bombs. defend your position of how a non-capitalistic society is superior with some examples, if that's how you feel. your foul language and overt hatred for "republicans" is insulting to me: a business-owning, tax-paying, charity-giving, biodiesel-making, Christian Republican who doesn't feel entitled to ANYTHING. are you gonna tell me to eff off, too, now?


#28 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 6:20pm


hukihuki,
you're a self righteous asshole,
fuck off,
happy?


#29 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 7:14pm


Yes Jibofo, Castle Foundation here in Hawaii did send out grant money for many of the public high schools here to purchase 4 mirages.

Its a shame that they would do budget cuts on a sport like paddling where there isn't much money being put into it in the first place.
Part of the fun of state tournaments is to see teams and students from the different islands compete against each other. This will just give smaller schools less of a chance to be apart of states. What a terrible decision by the HIADA.
As an assistant for paddling at Kalaheo HS, I'm sure something can be done to hopefully overturn this decision.


#30 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 7:38pm


RELAX - this ain't the mainland. Aside from the f-bombs [yeah] and politics to reduce the public schools athletic department supplies, equipment, and transportation by 50% is simply said as "can't understand normal thinking ish". The additional "boring" time that the youths will have will cost tax payers more in the long run then a few basketballs.

P.S. most hosting canoe clubs already have paddles for the youths to use.

P.S.S. maybe the public school system should consider reducing the crazy amount of policing on campus. how much does that cost the state???


#31 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 7:54pm


athletic directors of the high schools have the final say of were most of the money will be spent. volleyball, football, and basketball are the money makers for the schools. thats were youll see majority of schools athletic money going. paddling is a free event for anyone to watch. most club owners that merge with high schools dont ask for much or anything at all. the only time a club will ask for money is cost of registration for the OIA kids and maybe their trip. which the schools will only give 90 dollars per kid. thats not even the cost of plane fair. will they give money for maintenance of canoes and paddles??? hmph nope. most money is spent on bus fare for the kids. a bus trip is exspensive.

money is tight for the state. why was there a sudden split between OIA and na opio this past season? money was a big issue for that. what was OIA paying for and what was Na Opio paying for couldve been the cause as in bad handling in money? money missing thats not accounted for?


#32 Mon, 06/15/2009 - 11:26pm


Well, Nobody can say in truth that I can` t liven up an OC Paddler thread.

You people can thank me for arousing a little passion out there.

hukihuki speaks the same language I do and we are not alone.

You mean spirited, socialist liberals will just have to tolerate us.


#33 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 2:21am


hukihuki said

your foul language and overt hatred for “republicans” is insulting to me…who doesn’t feel entitled to ANYTHING.

Actually, from your post it appears you feel entitled to respect.


#34 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 3:40am


R.E.S.P.E.C.T.
Always has to be earned.


#35 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 5:36am


Comrades Unite-Hilarious

However, Fuzerider does highlight a logic flaw.

The government will take care of you and make wonderful, correct decisions.(I am not saying businesses will make better ones) They won't, especially in Hawaii.

I'll highlight one. Hawaii's economy is based greatly on tourism and visitors to Hawaii.

The tourists have many choices when they travel. They come (or used to come) to Hawaii because of the beautiful beaches, landscape, and relaxed feel of Hawaii.

So in the last 30 years, we have built up ugly condos, hotels, homes, etc on or near the very things that tourists come to Hawaii for-and also created traffic, congestion and the very opposite of a relaxed, unique feel and experience

In the meantime we have taxed tourists to death (hotel tax, rental car tax, etc.) and driven many away from Hawaii with taxes and the above congestion and destruction of the natural beauty of Hawaii.

One of government’s recent solutions to the budget crisis was to make it even more expensive for people to visit Hawaii-more tourist taxes. Doesn't make much sense to me and will in the long run damage the economy of Hawaii even more.


#36 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 5:42am


Fascist Corrupt Capitalist's take it easy, Pinko Commies and Socialist's relax (there I have insulted everyone equally) - It's the paddling that counts. I think we all can agree the main issue is how to get kids in a Wa'a. Have local clubs teamed up with local high schools to aid the local schools programs? More local involvement and less reliance on the state government for help could be an alternative to relying on the government titty. HI along with most other states are having budget issues, as are many individuals. Aggressive taxation, overspending and a stong recession are to blame for the funding issues, not any one political party; all should be held accountable. Bickering doesn't seem to help anything and counterproductive negativity solves nothing.


#37 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 6:21am


hank1 said

Bickering doesn’t seem to help anything and counterproductive negativity solves nothing.

But it's the internet and it's fun!

Seriously though, how much do the participants in the sports facing cuts pay to participate? I remember in high school I had to pay about $500 a season for my chosen extra-curricular activity (marching band, go ahead and poke fun, I had a good time). I could either pay this directly or offset the cost by doing various fund raisers. We got some support from the school district (like a truck rental to transport equipment), but nowhere near enough to fully fund ourselves. We relied a lot on parents volunteering time and materials, community support, and finding other ways to close our budget gaps.

Without fully understanding how Hawai'i high school athletics programs work I can't offer anything more than saying becoming more self-sufficient for any program is a good thing, wether through participant contributions, community support, or some other method (a private benefactor for instance).

Paddling, particularly in Hawai'i, is far more a lifetime pursuit than baseball or football and has a deep seated cultural link. The number of people involved may grow or shrink and opportunities harder to come by, but I'm fairly certain the sport won't disappear because of budgetary cutbacks when there are so many people involved at so many levels.


#38 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 7:39am


How many of you old timers on this board remember Gardner Brown. You guys remember that old man?? He started and kept going the Na Opio high school paddling program. Gardner had that thing going good with participation coming from State wide. All the local canoe clubs rallied behind the concept and the Na Opio paddling program was very successful.

Then, along comes Sammy Steamboat and his plans to put HS paddling in every high school. So, the DOE recognized paddling as a sport, does little to help fund the sport, which in turn stretches the high school budgets further because athletic directors need to fund the sport.

To me, the DOE should not have incorporated paddling into the high school sport programs to begin with. Na Opio was doing a great job of filling that need. Local county recreational programs and the local canoe clubs would continue to help the Na Opio program.

For me, I was hooping that the high schools would incoporate rowing into the high school sports arena. At least in rowing, our local kids would have a shot at getting scholarships in college.

JawsOut.


#39 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 8:43am


anowara, jibofo said it for me: i don't feel "entitled" to respect. i believe i have to EARN it. and i try to do that every day, sometimes succeeding and sometimes failing. and so it goes for everything worth trying to earn...so instead of blaming the external for that which i am not "given" in this life, i work harder. a great quote: "the same wind blows on us all, it's how you set your sail..." this little nugget applies to pretty much anything. even the budget cuts for school sports. there's a "work-around" for everything. be creative and find it.


#40 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 8:27pm


If the cash ain't there it ain't there. This state is pretty fucked up, so to speak, and it's killing the proverbial goose that laid the golden egg. It's time for some common sense to solve the problem. When a business helps at the local level, support that business. Even if it's a little more $, we need to support local small business rather than the big guys, or we're screwed. The gov't isn't always the best answer, but it's usually the most cumbersome and expensive in the long run. Oh yeah, did I mention that dealing with them is a PITA. I coached 20 years at a public school, and we sold cookies, did huli huli chicken, rummage sales, car washes, the whole nine yards to do trips and for states. If that's what it takes, do it. The kids appreciate the work involved after it's done and they actually learn that work has rewards, rather than being handed something free. Guarantee the outer island kids are doing just that and have for years. Oahu kids got it easy, most of the tourneys are there. The HHSAA and the AD's are hustling for all the sports, but they LOVE sports that are relatively self sufficient in terms of funding. Oh yeah, which party has run Hawaii for 49 years? I'm not for either party, they're both full of it.


#41 Tue, 06/16/2009 - 9:25pm


You people should elect me governor of Hawaii .

I`ll end welfare, drop corporate taxes , end entitlements, shrink government, support commerce, add moral clarity where there is none ..... and so on , etc...

Do you think I have a chance of winning ?

These kind of changes will create conditions where you`ll be able support your youth programs without any problems or lack of funding.

Fuzerider for Governor !!!


#42 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 3:04am


From what I've read on these boards, you can't even deliver the right canoe...so no, I don't think you have a chance of being governor of a state you don't understand.


#43 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 4:45am


Ah, "moral clarity", the mating call of the American Taliban. I love when religious fanatics believe they know what's right for everyone! Theocracys are so fun!


#44 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 4:58am


Fuze....hawaii already has a Republican governor....she's an epic fail. Seriously, put down the Kool-Aid, turn off Sean and Rush breathe deeply and work on some 'mental clarity'.


#45 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 5:49am


RatchetJaws...So Sammy Steamboats efforts to have the state/DOE to recognize and support the official "State Sport" is a bad thing? Think about it Jaws.

The State should support its "State Sport". The money that the DOE does put into the sport is very little compared to the amount of kids that participate. Especially girls.

With Canoe paddling now in the DOE the coaches now get some pay, albeit @50 cents an hour, but it is something to at least defray some of the personal costs to coaches. Most coaches end up coaching Na Opio and High School paddling anyway.

Na Opio is an awesome organization and is alive and well. It has also served a great purpose to show the state that the paddling community can support a paddling program for kids during the school year. The problem with Na Opio is there are no grade checks required to participate, which Na Opio has no real control over.

What I think Na Opio can do to continue to further the sport is to develop more lower grade level races (8th grade and below) and turn the high school grade races (9th grade and above) to long distance races on par with the ILH races. Thus showing the State what is possible for this sport and to provide positive outlets for kids.

When you drop Sammy Steamboats name and disgrace his legacy on this forum you compelled me to say something to his credit. He made one big step in legitimizing the Hawaii State Sport here in Hawaii. There are many more steps to be taken. He and others like him left canoe paddling where they thought would help us and we must pick up where they left off and keep this sport alive and help it prosper for the next generation.


#46 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 9:11am


Whoa brah.....Aoleama....no way I am disgracing Sam's name. If I gave you that impression then I apologize. I knew Sam personally. He used to lend my kid crews his koa at the state regatta. I first met Sam in the 70's and knew him a long time, so no way I putting the guy down.

I was trying to make reference to the DOE and their financial problems. As much as I love canoeing and am an advocate for the sport, the point I was trying to make was that the Na Opio program along with all the summer paddling programs more than filled the need to have canoeing for our youth. If there was going to be a sport to cut out so that we can save other sports, then canoeing would be it....in my opinion. I have a family member that is a teacher, and a close friend that is a AD. This financial problem is serious.

Props to Sam for making the sport legitimate. However, the DOE should have looked at what was already out there and not try reinvent the wheel...that is all I am saying. Peace brah...

JawsOut.


#47 Wed, 06/17/2009 - 9:38am


Kona J makes a good point, you people should scroll back up and read it.

I`m working on my pitch to EXXON on behaf of the paddlers of Hawaii.


#48 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 12:53am


Now let's see.

When the government doesn't have enough money what should it cut?

Fire, police, education, water, health services,EMT? It is going to be the things that can be paid for in some other way, by the people who really feel those things are important.

Can you guarantee that paddling will reduce obesity among the general population? Can you guarantee it will cut drug use? Heck, someone on this forum who didn't know me emailed me about drug use, so I know it doesn't cut drug use among paddlers. In fact, it may be that sports increase drug use. Just look at the pros.

Or will paddling make those already disposed to physical activity just a little healthier. "The physical gifted just get more gifted." In other words, the rich get richer.

Is it we don't want our sport cut, cut someone elses? Which sport is better, soccer, or cross-country, or swimming, or paddling? Which is cheaper per participant?

What about the couch potatoes? What if they don't want their taxes going to sports? What if they have more votes? Do we establish an aerobic sports dictatorship. What if the new dictator likes pro football...exclusively...to watch.

Admit it. Some of you guys want to be paddle bums and want someone else to pay for it.

Hawaii is probably the only state out of 50 (or 57 for some of you) that underwrites paddling in any form. The other 49 don't. You know the sports that indirectly get state or municipal support? The spectator sports. I could watch pro basketball three days a week and I know that won't reduce my heartrate.

Who sponsors the Tahitians? An oil company.

Get real, guys. Nobody is interested in paying for your lifestyle. It is fun, but most of us have jobs and that's how we pay for it.
~~~~~~~~~~
YankeeHo'okele
"Anyone can steer the ship when the sea is calm" - Syrus Publilius


#49 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 12:56pm


Great. They've teamed-up... and missed the point.


#50 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 1:06pm


Must be something about paddling in cold water. Maybe it restricts blood flow to the head.


#51 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 1:13pm


Yes, of course, Yankee! Why should perfectly useful public funds be spent on paddling for kids when they could be devoted to far more important causes such as illegal invasions? Remember (for the int'l audience), here in the U.S., if you spend public money on helping out the people, it's communism, but if you spend those same dollars on killing foreign brown people, it's patriotism.


#52 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:10pm


Can't say that I've seem much in the way of posting above. Lots of "gimmie, gimmie," but no arguments above the third grade level.

Unless of course, catcalls in group strength are an argument.

They do teach how to argue a point out their in paradise? Or is it the state suddenly realized the money that should have been used on teaching logic has all been pissed away on give-away programs and they nevr taught that sort of stuff and are getting worried.

I know California is near bankrupty 'cause they can't ever balance a budget. Must be some real rocket scientists on carbon fiber hulls running things as you touch the Pacific.

Yup, world should look to you for advice. You got it all wrapped up.
~~~~~~~~~~
YankeeHo'okele
"Anyone can steer the ship when the sea is calm" - Syrus Publilius


#53 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:11pm


My 2cts : Paddling is not just a sport in Tahiti...


#54 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:14pm


Well, how could anyone possibly counter your flawless "everything bad is caused by liberals and commies logic", Yankee? Talk about a third grade argument. Keep a strong bottom shoulder, and don't forget to continue parroting those reactionary talking points!


#55 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:32pm


This thread seems to have taken on a life of it's own. The point is that they are going to limit the number of crews that make the States in the various sports. They are not going to cut paddling, and the different leagues can still have their championships. As in HCRA, only so many from each association qualify to go to the states.


#56 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:51pm


Funny I was talking about how difficult it is to figure out how to finance paddling, when other folks have other priorities. No fair way to parcel out the money and do all the things that need to be done.

Don't remember ever mentioning "communism," but now that you mention it, thanks for bringing it up. It does relate in a way.

Now it is true the Nazis and the Communists were big on financing Olympic sports competitors because they thought it showed how sucessful their totalitarians states were. Most of the women members of the East German swim teams have health difficulties brought on by East German "better living through chemistry."

I don't think anyone on this forum would like to have a totalitarian government running their sport.

Ever read about how Saddam Hussein's son coached the Iraqi national soccer team? No fun at all.

Yeah, let government officials run sports.
~~~~~~~~~~
YankeeHo'okele
"Anyone can steer the ship when the sea is calm" - Syrus Publilius


#57 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 2:57pm


YankeeHookele said: "Nobody is interested in paying for your lifestyle. It is fun, but most of us have jobs and that’s how we pay for it."

We're talking about programs for school-age children here...

You listed education along with fire, police, EMT's, etc. Athletics have always been a part of a high-schoolers education. We provide all these sports, including paddling, so that our youth are given the opportunities to engage in activities that lead to a healthier lifestyle. No guarantees... but I know that a major portion of the kids I paddled with in high-school are still paddling.

How about this: don't take ANY money away from ANY high-school sports... please don't answer, I can already predict your dogmatic reply.

As far as I'm concerned, I don't need to be wary of the couch-potatoes and their votes - it's people like you - people that would rather have that dollar remain in your pocket, that you WEREN'T about to spend on youth paddling - that we need to watch out for.


#58 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 3:01pm


wow, people will sieze any chance they get to jump on their little soap box.

outrigger canoe paddling is different from any other sport, just ask people in hawai'i, tahiti, or any ocean based culture. if you don't understand that, then you have no reason to argue on this forum.

the reason hawai'i is the only state with canoe paddling as a high school sport is that it is the only one that hasn't been razed to the level of the rest of america. let the other 49 states completely disregard their native cultures.

hawai'i does balance it's state budget as required by it's state consitution. so the idea that hawai'i will become another california is irrelevant.


#59 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 3:36pm


Right! 'Cuz everyone knows state sponsored sport inevitably leads to genocidal totalitarianist regimes. Ever heard of Canada? All kine programs to develop athletes but no atrocities to speak of. You got some weak-ass partisan rhetoric for a guy who's supposed to be a historian, Yankee.


#60 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 3:45pm


Here's a viewpoint from Australia free from your Right versus Left political agendas that have clouded the issue(man you Americans are a fascinating bunch to observe)
Outrigger paddling is Hawaii's state sport right?, and thats because its deeply entwined in your Polynesian culture, so it makes good economic sense to invest in something that is both a cultural and sporting endeavour, two for the price of one.
Also any Hawaiian kid that shows promise playing football or basketball is inevitably going to be snapped up by a mainland school / college isnt he / she.
The rest of the world recognises Hawaii and Tahiti as the twin meccas (sorry if I offended any "patriots" by the use of that word) of outrigger paddling and all that it encompasses it just seems a terrible shame that the Hawaiian government doesnt recognise that as well.
Just look at the Tahitian dominance of your Molokai race for the past few years, you should be investing more in paddling not less, and dont accept the decision as a fait accompli you live in a democracy, kick up a stink.


#61 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 5:46pm


I'm sorry to differ, but the de facto State sport in Hawaii is GOLF.


#62 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 8:37pm


Well, from a younger actual student perspective, i can see where this would be effecting the programs. I think the biggest hit would be in the OIA divisions only because the schools funding comes from the state itself, whereas ILH can almost singlehandedly sustain itself with its own damn tuition charged money. I have yet to hear the two big hawaiian schools here (punahou and kamehameha) step in and try and take paddling out of this whole mix. Both those schools have huge names, especially the trustees and their background of hawaiian history, can they help voice the opinion of the public and schools and stress to our state how important paddling is to hawaii.

And have they even been to a paddling race before? Can they honestly say that paddling isnt as big as football? Sure, its not the most loveliest spectator sport to nonpaddlers, but the participation of students huge. Most teams have enough paddlers to fill up a small football team. There are so many kids here that would be just disappointed if they had to cut back teams like this.

Even look around PAST just school season. So many kids paddle off ILH/OIA season into OHCRA and Hui Waa and some even na'opi'o. Paddling is huge, and there is no actual "Paddling Season" here. Its all just year round. Many kids paddle, many kids love to paddle, and many kids love to compete in a race sporting the jersey and the boat with the school name printed on it. I know i do. We can't let them do this. I hope my argument made sense in some way and that these are valid points.

Aloha,
kcchee11


#63 Thu, 06/18/2009 - 9:33pm


I think it's important that everyone recognize the efforts of goto, jc9, and the international audience to bring the focus back to the original concern of ensuring that the youth of Hawaii not only have the positive influences and advantages that organized sports provide (read one of the numerous studies on the subject) but also are given the chance to maintain their cultural identity. The benefit of both should be seen by any rational individual regardless of party affiliation, regionalism, or personal creed.

Also, I would like to point out that at no point in time did anyone suggest to "let government officials run sports". Instead it has been suggested that funding options should be discussed and pursued prior to making cuts in programs that have future payouts. (Again, read a study on the positive impact of youth sports.) Paddling outrigger canoes provides a positive physical outlet, a stronger sense of self (for those of Polynesian descent), and the development of leadership, cooperation, and socialization skills. Funding should be found for a sport that, as previously said, hits two birds with one stone: athletic and cultural. And Jim brought-up Canada. Fine example: significant governmental sports funding AND government funded recognition of cultural identity (both Native and French... for better or worse.)

And please, as one main-lander of European descent to another, can we please cut all the "you people", finger-waging, holier/smarter-than-thou, crap. Besides didn't "you/us people" from the North East dump a bunch of tea in a harbor once because we weren't real thrilled with where taxes were being levied and how tax dollars were being spent? If the Hawaiians want what little funds are available to go to paddling, it's their right. Who are you to tell them how to spend it?

There is a difference between communism, socialism, and having an opinion on how tax dollars generated by a community are spent by that community.

On a side note, thanks kcchee for proving that the youth of Hawaii can be intelligent, well-spoken, well-mannered, and see the benefit of their participation in their state sport


#64 Fri, 06/19/2009 - 7:59am


Yankee Hookele,

You said (of Hawaii), "They do teach how to argue a point out their in paradise?"

Should be "there". I learned that in 3rd grade.


#65 Fri, 06/19/2009 - 1:23pm


More food for thought:

Hawaii teachers are THE lowest paid in the nation (taking cost-of-living into account -- that's right, 50th out of 50).

Linda Lingle has NOT applied for MILLIONS of dollars of federal stimulus grants specifically created to prevent cuts in education and insists on "bargaining" in the media BEFORE sitting down to discuss issues with the union leaders.

Education includes more than reading and math. At least, it should.


#66 Fri, 06/19/2009 - 2:03pm


Linda sounds good to me . I`d like to trade you our gov Baldacci for her...


#67 Sat, 06/20/2009 - 6:27am


Oh dear, all the F-bombs were "for the children?" Well that explains the lack of content.

Here is a typical OCPaddler thread.

Tom from Kalaupapa: Anyone got any ideas on a better steering paddle?

Dick from Kathmandu: Well, on our boat when I steer, I do nearly all my poking and paddling on the right side so I'd like a steering paddle with a right hand grip so I can hold it with one hand and check my GPS with the other.

Harry from Honolulu: Dick you're from Kathmandu and everyone from Kathmandu is a jerk.

Larry: F-you, Dick. What do you know about steering paddles!

Moe: I hate all you folks from Kathmandu. They are so, so uncool.

Curly: Dick is soitenly stupid, izzen he, Moe.

Now, normally in these threads Harry, Larry, Moe, and Curly have absolutely nothing to contribute but vitriol and don't realize that they bore other posters and turn people off.

Among normal people, someone would have said, "Dick, that may work for you, but I'm not sure that will work for everyone. Have you heard to the Foti Biscuit, Tom?"

Not at OCPaddler.

I ran into someone in Virginia last month and for some reason the subject of OCPaddler came up. The Virginia paddler said they no longer posted there because it was cliquish and a turn off...a bunch of guys trying to talk tough behind anonymous screennames and sometimes just trolling. I notice anyone who offers any comments outside "groupthink" gets pounced on. There was that South African who was interesting, but I guess his ideas weren't cool.

Every now and then if you ask a specific technical question that can be answered before Harry, Larry, Curly and Moe.can chime in, OCPaddler is useful.

Otherwise it is on the"Oh yeah? Yeah." and "I know you are, but what am I?" level.

I guess you entertain yourselves. Man, that is so cool.
~~~~~~~~~~
YankeeHo'okele
"Anyone can steer the ship when the sea is calm" - Syrus Publilius


#68 Sat, 06/20/2009 - 9:00am


My buddy just got an all carbon Biscuit. It's a sweet steering paddle.


#69 Sat, 06/20/2009 - 9:46am


Steering paddles are so stone age If you aint steering with your feet , you re in the wrong boat...


#70 Sat, 06/20/2009 - 10:16am


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